Haven for the Human Amoeba

I don't think you differentiate between asexuality and celibacy. The two are different. The celibate has made a conscious decision, either in response to an obligation or in response to a desire, to be celibate. To not engage in sexual activity. The celibate defines the state of celibacy negatively, in terms of what he/she will not do. The asexual is a person who, in spite of the social, family and personal pressure, feels no attraction or personal inclination toward intimate sexual relations or expression with another person of any sex.

This is a very good point, however, my problem is that I don't know at this point exactly what I am. An acquaintance who has a sister who is asexual told me that I must be asexual because I've been without anyone for so long (over 20 years now), that a sexual person wouldn't be able to live that way. It started off as voluntary celibacy and kind of turned into a lifestyle that it would be very difficult if not impossible to change. I'm still thinking about this one. My original reasons were that I didn't want to risk catching AIDS, so I'd wait for a vaccine or someone else who was both uninfected and willing to be monogamous if I ever fell into a mutual relationship of love. Neither one ever happened and I think, because of the way I am around people, probably the latter never will. Does that make me asexual? I don't know! However, it seems that I wouldn't be the first in my family to go most of a lifetime without sex as both of my grandmothers seem to have been that way after having children. [It's hard to be sure since we don't talk about this in my family.] On my mother's side, there were two children, then the husband died; on my father's side, there were about six or eight children, then a hysterectomy and that was given as the excuse for not having sex anymore. I never wanted children...I just stopped accepting sexual requests around age 21 and that was it, but neither did I want to get married either as I found the idea of being under a guy's control repulsive...I want to be under my own control as much as possible.

Therese Shellabarger / The Roving Reporter - Civis Mundi tlshell@... / http://tlshell.cnc.net/

I was nineteen years old, and I didn't want any sex at all. I could deal with most other forms of human contact and sought them out, but I didn't seek sex. The only people who understood me or even gave a damn about my differences were gay.

I didn't know of any gay people when I was growing up, but I can identify with what you're saying. I never wanted to date or anything the whole time I was in school and found the whole dating scene incomprehensible and stupid. I thought it was stupid the way other girls acted about guys, and I thought the guys who were looking for girls simply assinine.

Therese Shellabarger / The Roving Reporter - Civis Mundi tlshell@... / http://tlshell.cnc.net/

On 2 Jan 2003, 22:35 +00:00, elizabeth_burns2003 said:

I don't think you differentiate between asexuality and celibacy. The two are different. The celibate has made a conscious decision, either in response to an obligation or in response to a desire, to be celibate. To not engage in sexual activity. The celibate defines the state of celibacy negatively, in terms of what he/she will not do. The asexual is a person who, in spite of the social, family and personal pressure, feels no attraction or personal inclination toward intimate sexual relations or expression with another person of any sex.

This is a very good point, however, my problem is that I don't know at this point exactly what I am. An acquaintance who has a sister who is asexual told me that I must be asexual because I've been without anyone for so long (over 20 years now), that a sexual person wouldn't be able to live that way. It started off as voluntary celibacy and kind of turned into a lifestyle that it would be very difficult if not impossible to change. I'm still thinking about this one. My original reasons were that I didn't want to risk catching AIDS, so I'd wait for a vaccine or someone else who was both uninfected and willing to be monogamous if I ever fell into a mutual relationship of love. Neither one ever happened and I think, because of the way I am around people, probably the latter never will. Does that make me asexual? I don't know! However, it seems that I wouldn't be the first in my family to go most of a lifetime without sex as both of my grandmothers seem to have been that way after having children. [It's hard to be sure since we don't talk about this in my family.] On my mother's side, there were two children, then the husband died; on my father's side, there were about six or eight children, then a hysterectomy and that was given as the excuse for not having sex anymore. I never wanted children...I just stopped accepting sexual requests around age 21 and that was it, but neither did I want to get married either as I found the idea of being under a guy's control repulsive...I want to be under my own control as much as possible.

---

Therese Shellabarger / The Roving Reporter - Civis Mundi tlshell@c... / http://tlshell.cnc.net/

My feelings are extremely similar to yours. I do have what is called a "romance drive." I like intimacy provided it is intellectual or emotional, but I draw the line at French kissing and sex. Nice to meet you.

If the repulsion to sex is antisexuality, then I'm very surprised no one brings up George Orwell's Nineteen-Eighty-Four. When I think of antisexuality, this is really the only cultural reference I have for it, and the only way in which I relate to it.

In the third chapter, Winston has a sort of vision of a place called the Golden Country, in which he sees this.

"The girl with dark hair was coming towards them across the field. With what seemed a single movement she tore off her clothes and flung them disdainfully aside. Her body was white and smooth, but it aroused no desire in him, indeed he barely looked at it. What overwhelmed him in that instant was admiration for the gesture with which she had thrown her clothes aside. With its grace and carelessness it seemed to annihilate a whole culture, a whole system of thought, as though Big Brother and the Party and the Thought Police could all be swept into nothingness by a single splendid movement of the arm. That too was a gesture belonging to the ancient time. Winston woke up with the word 'Shakespeare' on his lips."

http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984/3/

This particular vision is not wholly sexual, but makes the point that the antisexuality that serves the state is artifice, and this artifice is designed not to work around nature but against it. It is meant, in fact, to destroy nature. I do not believe that sex is repulsive for my fellow human beings, and I desire no such social construction of it in opposition to nature. Whatever repulsion I have, it is personal and affects only me. It is not meant to serve any state, agenda, or religious purpose.

"When he had gone with that woman it had been his first lapse in two years or thereabouts. Consorting with prostitutes was forbidden, of course, but it was one of those rules that you could occasionally nerve yourself to break. It was dangerous, but it was not a life-and- death matter[...]The aim of the Party was not merely to prevent men and women from forming loyalties which it might not be able to control. Its real, undeclared purpose was to remove all pleasure from the sexual act. Not love so much as eroticism was the enemy, inside marriage as well as outside it."

In the end, the state of Oceania doesn't really fear the sex, but the orgasm itself, the sharing of it, and the connection it brings about between two people as something to which the state and its aims will be made subservient. So according to Orwell, it is the orgasm that facilitates a cemented relationship between mates, and ultimately, between families. It is right that the aims of the state or religion be made subservient to the connection, physical or otherwise, of mates. Have you ever heard the appellation, "Eros, builder of cities?" It's something that human intuition tells us, and I think this name for Eros is correct. Oceania has embraced antisexuality- and with it constant want and war.

Look at the antisexuality of our own times served up generously from the Concerned Women for America or the Lahaye Institute. I tell you, these harpies be the death of us because they teach not just hatred of gays, but hatred of the loyalty between those who love no matter what, and first of all, the hatred of individual integrity. The Concerned Women for America are probably not themselves repulsed by sex, but they have worked toward the end of making sex a social construction, taking it away from the individual, away from lovers, away from integrity and blameless nature.

And of course, as they become more powerful, we tread the path toward constant want and war.

This is the essence of antisexuality to me- the artifice attempting to destroy nature. I don't think my recoiling or seeking distance is unnatural.

If the repulsion to sex is antisexuality, then I'm very surprised no one brings up George Orwell's Nineteen-Eighty-Four. When I think of antisexuality, this is really the only cultural reference I have for it, and the only way in which I relate to it.

In the third chapter, Winston has a sort of vision of a place called the Golden Country, in which he sees this.

"The girl with dark hair was coming towards them across the field. With what seemed a single movement she tore off her clothes and flung them disdainfully aside. Her body was white and smooth, but it aroused no desire in him, indeed he barely looked at it. What overwhelmed him in that instant was admiration for the gesture with which she had thrown her clothes aside. With its grace and carelessness it seemed to annihilate a whole culture, a whole system of thought, as though Big Brother and the Party and the Thought Police could all be swept into nothingness by a single splendid movement of the arm. That too was a gesture belonging to the ancient time. Winston woke up with the word 'Shakespeare' on his lips."

http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984/3/

This particular vision is not wholly sexual, but makes the point that the antisexuality that serves the state is artifice, and this artifice is designed not to work around nature but against it. It is meant, in fact, to destroy nature. I do not believe that sex is repulsive for my fellow human beings, and I desire no such social construction of it in opposition to nature. Whatever repulsion I have, it is personal and affects only me. It is not meant to serve any state, agenda, or religious purpose.

"When he had gone with that woman it had been his first lapse in two years or thereabouts. Consorting with prostitutes was forbidden, of course, but it was one of those rules that you could occasionally nerve yourself to break. It was dangerous, but it was not a life- and- death matter[...]The aim of the Party was not merely to prevent men and women from forming loyalties which it might not be able to control. Its real, undeclared purpose was to remove all pleasure from the sexual act. Not love so much as eroticism was the enemy, inside marriage as well as outside it."

In the end, the state of Oceania doesn't really fear the sex, but the orgasm itself, the sharing of it, and the connection it brings about between two people as something to which the state and its aims will be made subservient. So according to Orwell, it is the orgasm that facilitates a cemented relationship between mates, and ultimately, between families. It is right that the aims of the state or religion be made subservient to the connection, physical or otherwise, of mates. Have you ever heard the appellation, "Eros, builder of cities?" It's something that human intuition tells us, and I think this name for Eros is correct. Oceania has embraced antisexuality- and with it constant want and war.

Look at the antisexuality of our own times served up generously from the Concerned Women for America or the Lahaye Institute. I tell you, these harpies be the death of us because they teach not just hatred of gays, but hatred of the loyalty between those who love no matter what, and first of all, the hatred of individual integrity. The Concerned Women for America are probably not themselves repulsed by sex, but they have worked toward the end of making sex a social construction, taking it away from the individual, away from lovers, away from integrity and blameless nature.

And of course, as they become more powerful, we tread the path toward constant want and war.

This is the essence of antisexuality to me- the artifice attempting to destroy nature. I don't think my recoiling or seeking distance is unnatural.

DARNIT! Here's the link to the second quote.

http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984/6/

Both of 'em come from part 1 of the novel. 1984 is not the best- written piece of dystopia, but many of the ideas it contains have resonated powerfully over the decades. And understanding of this book is extremely necessary in New Bushistan, or Fascistan, or whatever the new empire will be called.

The link for the second quote is:

http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984/6/

The link for the second quote is:

http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984/6/

how odd.. I would have quoted not only Orwell.. but Huxley too (the author of "Brave New World").. his idea of the world in 642 AF (after [henry] Ford) seemed a bit hedonistic.. but you must remember in that world ppl arent "born".. they're made (quite literally, in hatcheries.. with cloning being used and "social predestination" and pavolian conditioning throughout your formative years).

given how today's un-ppl are now.. I think Huxley may have had the right idea.

I've had people like me, and yes at times it has made me nervous or uncomfortable. But I don't get nervous or uncomfortable at the mention of the word "erection" or at the thought of someone else being attracted to another person (or even me). It's only bothersome if they stand too close or give me "the look". If someone interesting likes me then I'm flattered, and apparently I've mastered the art of creating some sort of physical/emotional distance so only rarely does anyone actually try anything.

I never said it was wrong or freakish to be repulsed by sexual activities *that do or realistically could involve you in the future*. If someone I didn't know walked up to me and started any sort of innapropriate touching, yeah---that's repulsive. Or if someone made sexual comments about me or my body, yeah---that's repulsive. But that's not what we were talking about. We were talking about the mere mention of sexual activities in an environment where no one was likely to jump out and perform them. And besides... repulsion IS anguish. Are you saying that you're happy being repulsed all the time?

I didn't know of any gay people when I was growing up, but I can identify with what you're saying. I never wanted to date or anything the whole time I was in school and found the whole dating scene incomprehensible and stupid. I thought it was stupid the way other girls acted about guys, and I thought the guys who were looking for girls simply assinine.

---

Therese Shellabarger / The Roving Reporter - Civis Mundi tlshell@c... / http://tlshell.cnc.net/

Yeah, I always thought that was stupid, too. One of my requirements for my female friends was finding someone who *didn't* act like an idiot every time a guy walks into the room. I knew this one girl who would actually pull her shirt down and lean over slightly to show her cleavage every time anything male was within a 20 ft. radius. She said she wasn't even aware of doing it....some sort of semi- subconscious breeding mechanism. Heh.

I've had people like me, and yes at times it has made me nervous or uncomfortable. But I don't get nervous or uncomfortable at the mention of the word "erection" or at the thought of someone else being attracted to another person (or even me). It's only bothersome if they stand too close or give me "the look".

I'm not nervous or uncomfortable at the mention of erection or other sexual acts. I'm not sickened by the idea that people may be attracted to each other. Although I find the sound of kissing to be disgusting. I demand my distance if I sense someone is attracted to me. The look? I'm blind. It goes nowhere, it's never even been anywhere before. I don't miss it because I never knew it.

If someone interesting

likes me then I'm flattered, and apparently I've mastered the art of creating some sort of physical/emotional distance so only rarely does anyone actually try anything.

Same here.

I never said it was wrong or freakish to be repulsed by sexual activities *that do or realistically could involve you in the future*. If someone I didn't know walked up to me and started any sort of innapropriate touching, yeah---that's repulsive. Or if someone made sexual comments about me or my body, yeah---that's repulsive. But that's not what we were talking about. We were talking about the mere mention of sexual activities in an environment where no one was likely to jump out and perform them.

Okay, so I'm dense too.

And besides...

repulsion IS anguish. Are you saying that you're happy being repulsed all the time?

What makes you think repulsion is anguish? How did you learn to connect the two? Anguish? In my case that's old news. Hey it's the life. I've been in pain and cut off from the world a long time. I don't think I'll ever be totally out of pain.

This is actually one of my big problems with 1984. Orwell puts forth that orgasm can't be controlled by the state, so it has to be eliminated. Ograsm, according to Orwell, is the fountain from which the magic of human intimacy flows, and that intimacy poses some threat to the state's hegemony.

Really the state in 1984 is anti-intimate, Orwell just assumes (as many people have) that intimacy and sexuality can be equated. People cold swim in endorphines 'till the cows come home (Brave New World) and it wouldn't pose any intrinsic threat to Oceania. What would pose a threat is for people to receieve safety and security from any source other than the state.

Antisexuality assumes that sex is bad because sex is somehow intrinsically important. To an extent this is true (some sex produces babies, spreads STDs, and most sex is somehow pleasurable). Sex positivism assumes the same thing. Is it possible that someone can consider sex, in their lives, to be intrinsically UNIMPORTANT, to feel like sex is unappealing but not particularely repulsive. To use your (I think) earlier example, if someone becomes sexually obsessed with what's unnerving isn't the fact that there is sexual activity being proposed (what's so special about sexual activity?) but rather the emphasis and importance that's being places on that activity. It would be much the same if someone came up to them with an obsessive desire to play soccer.

Hope this makes some sense,

-Dj

If the repulsion to sex is antisexuality, then I'm very surprised no one brings up George Orwell's Nineteen-Eighty-Four. When I think of antisexuality, this is really the only cultural reference I have for it, and the only way in which I relate to it.

In the third chapter, Winston has a sort of vision of a place called the Golden Country, in which he sees this.

"The girl with dark hair was coming towards them across the field. With what seemed a single movement she tore off her clothes and flung them disdainfully aside. Her body was white and smooth, but it aroused no desire in him, indeed he barely looked at it. What overwhelmed him in that instant was admiration for the gesture with which she had thrown her clothes aside. With its grace and carelessness it seemed to annihilate a whole culture, a whole system of thought, as though Big Brother and the Party and the Thought Police could all be swept into nothingness by a single splendid movement of the arm. That too was a gesture belonging to the ancient time. Winston woke up with the word 'Shakespeare' on his lips."

http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984/3/

This particular vision is not wholly sexual, but makes the point that the antisexuality that serves the state is artifice, and this artifice is designed not to work around nature but against it. It is meant, in fact, to destroy nature. I do not believe that sex is repulsive for my fellow human beings, and I desire no such social construction of it in opposition to nature. Whatever repulsion I have, it is personal and affects only me. It is not meant to serve any state, agenda, or religious purpose.

"When he had gone with that woman it had been his first lapse in two years or thereabouts. Consorting with prostitutes was forbidden, of course, but it was one of those rules that you could occasionally nerve yourself to break. It was dangerous, but it was not a life-and- death matter[...]The aim of the Party was not merely to prevent men and women from forming loyalties which it might not be able to control. Its real, undeclared purpose was to remove all pleasure from the sexual act. Not love so much as eroticism was the enemy, inside marriage as well as outside it."

In the end, the state of Oceania doesn't really fear the sex, but the orgasm itself, the sharing of it, and the connection it brings about between two people as something to which the state and its aims will be made subservient. So according to Orwell, it is the orgasm that facilitates a cemented relationship between mates, and ultimately, between families. It is right that the aims of the state or religion be made subservient to the connection, physical or otherwise, of mates. Have you ever heard the appellation, "Eros, builder of cities?" It's something that human intuition tells us, and I think this name for Eros is correct. Oceania has embraced antisexuality- and with it constant want and war.

Look at the antisexuality of our own times served up generously from the Concerned Women for America or the Lahaye Institute. I tell you, these harpies be the death of us because they teach not just hatred of gays, but hatred of the loyalty between those who love no matter what, and first of all, the hatred of individual integrity. The Concerned Women for America are probably not themselves repulsed by sex, but they have worked toward the end of making sex a social construction, taking it away from the individual, away from lovers, away from integrity and blameless nature.

And of course, as they become more powerful, we tread the path toward constant want and war.

This is the essence of antisexuality to me- the artifice attempting to destroy nature. I don't think my recoiling or seeking distance is unnatural.

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*nod* bipolar alone is enough to make most guys cross you off their list. (Bipolar type II w/psychosis, OCD, GAD and a few other malfunctions added in for good flavour). I'm going to be faced with a major decision within the next year and a half... try to get SSDI (i hate having to prove that i'm fucked up) or get married and get on his insurance. I'm in a good relationship (other than the sex thing)... but i can't decide what's worse, rushing into things... or trying to come up with $2000/mo for medication on top of living expenses... -s

Sarae Montgomery We're all mad here!

I agree. My recent decision to become celibate has been based on all of those events in my life. One I failed to mention was being with the man who gave me HPV for a year and half before finding out he was married, before I knew what hit me he was in California with his wife. I put two and two together... They were married 3 years, he was making me his mistress without my knowledge or permission for half of his marriage. He was also sleeping with half of Central Ohio during that last year and a half as well. My next fear is that no one will accept my decision, or want have any sort of relationship with me because of my celibacy. Not only do I have to struggle with the acceptance of my HPV, and my disability, (I'm on disability for bipolar, ADHD, borderline personality disorder, and agoraphobia.) but I'm also a big girl, or BBW as we like to say, Big Beautiful Woman. So all in all, I'm not exactly every Ken's Barbie.

Sarae Montgomery <sarmnstr@...> wrote:fairly similar story here... molested by grandfather at 2 and 8, didn't trust anyone until i was 17... then the guy he went and tried the exact same shit my grandfather did (he was recently accused of rape and is quite a dangerous figure in my life, but he's realising that I won't put up with any of that anymore. Being used 3 times is 3 times too many and it ended there with him). I'm still learning how to trust, but i'm about to just give up hope. I've been in the same relationship for over 2 years... and if we could just remove the whole sex thing, it would be damn near perfect. If only. I feel bad, but still recoil even at close friends and relatives. it's no wonder. there will be times that i can't stand the touch/sound of someone making contact with me and I just want to crawl out of my skin... I don't know how to assure them that it's not them, it's their actions and my sometimes over-sensitive senses... the drawing away is not because I don't like them as a whole. if only this life thing were easier. -s

---

Sarae Montgomery We're all mad here!

From

"Deidre R." <cowgirldeebop@...>

To

<[email protected]>

Sent

Wednesday, January 07, 2004 12:29 AM

Subject

Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] Re: Where's the line?

I've discovered that all my bad experiences sexually related to my current place in life has caused me to lash out agressively at anyone who shows sexual or romantic interest in me. It could be attributed to a lot of things.. my grandpa raping my cousin, being cheated on or otherwise vexed in every attempted romantic relationship, being diagnosed with HPV. I associate the affection with the bad. And thus instantly recoil and become aggressive, and at times defensive, often getting sick to my stomach. I've even recoiled from my own mothers touch before, and felt horrible for doing it after seeing the look on her face...

elizabeth_burns2003 <burnsei@...> wrote:--- In [email protected], "elizabeth_burns2003"

burnsei@n... said:

When someone is interested in me, and I sense it, I feel oppressed. I feel like the air around me just got several pounds of pressure added to it. Being noticed is extremely stressful in my case.

Gelf@p... said:

Hmm, I've been noticing an interesting thing here - its not just that you're not interested in sex, it seems you're really seriously upset (maybe, possibly, even enraged?) at the simple thought that someone might direct sexual thoughts or desires toward you.

Yes, I find my sensation of another person's interest upsetting, stressful and difficult to deal with. I become defensive and I want my space, some distance away from the person and the situation in which the attraction happened. I don't feel anything like bitter rage. My inclinations are more defensive than aggressive. I would not strike out at anyone who was interested in my, but I would brush a hand away. I cringe or wince often when I'm touched. The people who are acquainted with me and become friendly sense my need for distance. There are times when a friend will say to me, "I want to give you a hug." And I answer, "That's all right, go ahead." And then I get a hug and that's so nice. Nice from beginning, from being asked to getting it. I don't like silent and facile violations of my personal space, of my body. Kissing is a violation. Yes it is, to me. I don't hate people, but I want them to understand that. And really, the vast majority, men and women, do.

---

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Hi again Sarae. You seem to be the only person who wants to reply to me on this board. I actually am on SSI so if you need any support let me know I'd be happy to help you in any way I can by offering my own experiences or advice.

Sarae Montgomery <sarmnstr@...> wrote:*nod* bipolar alone is enough to make most guys cross you off their list. (Bipolar type II w/psychosis, OCD, GAD and a few other malfunctions added in for good flavour). I'm going to be faced with a major decision within the next year and a half... try to get SSDI (i hate having to prove that i'm fucked up) or get married and get on his insurance. I'm in a good relationship (other than the sex thing)... but i can't decide what's worse, rushing into things... or trying to come up with $2000/mo for medication on top of living expenses... -s

Sarae Montgomery We're all mad here!

I agree. My recent decision to become celibate has been based on all of those events in my life. One I failed to mention was being with the man who gave me HPV for a year and half before finding out he was married, before I knew what hit me he was in California with his wife. I put two and two together... They were married 3 years, he was making me his mistress without my knowledge or permission for half of his marriage. He was also sleeping with half of Central Ohio during that last year and a half as well. My next fear is that no one will accept my decision, or want have any sort of relationship with me because of my celibacy. Not only do I have to struggle with the acceptance of my HPV, and my disability, (I'm on disability for bipolar, ADHD, borderline personality disorder, and agoraphobia.) but I'm also a big girl, or BBW as we like to say, Big Beautiful Woman. So all in all, I'm not exactly every Ken's Barbie.

Sarae Montgomery <sarmnstr@...> wrote:fairly similar story here... molested by grandfather at 2 and 8, didn't trust anyone until i was 17... then the guy he went and tried the exact same shit my grandfather did (he was recently accused of rape and is quite a dangerous figure in my life, but he's realising that I won't put up with any of that anymore. Being used 3 times is 3 times too many and it ended there with him). I'm still learning how to trust, but i'm about to just give up hope. I've been in the same relationship for over 2 years... and if we could just remove the whole sex thing, it would be damn near perfect. If only. I feel bad, but still recoil even at close friends and relatives. it's no wonder. there will be times that i can't stand the touch/sound of someone making contact with me and I just want to crawl out of my skin... I don't know how to assure them that it's not them, it's their actions and my sometimes over-sensitive senses... the drawing away is not because I don't like them as a whole. if only this life thing were easier. -s

---

Sarae Montgomery We're all mad here!

From

"Deidre R." <cowgirldeebop@...>

To

<[email protected]>

Sent

Wednesday, January 07, 2004 12:29 AM

Subject

Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] Re: Where's the line?

I've discovered that all my bad experiences sexually related to my current place in life has caused me to lash out agressively at anyone who shows sexual or romantic interest in me. It could be attributed to a lot of things.. my grandpa raping my cousin, being cheated on or otherwise vexed in every attempted romantic relationship, being diagnosed with HPV. I associate the affection with the bad. And thus instantly recoil and become aggressive, and at times defensive, often getting sick to my stomach. I've even recoiled from my own mothers touch before, and felt horrible for doing it after seeing the look on her face...

elizabeth_burns2003 <burnsei@...> wrote:--- In [email protected], "elizabeth_burns2003"

burnsei@n... said:

When someone is interested in me, and I sense it, I feel oppressed. I feel like the air around me just got several pounds of pressure added to it. Being noticed is extremely stressful in my case.

Gelf@p... said:

Hmm, I've been noticing an interesting thing here - its not just that you're not interested in sex, it seems you're really seriously upset (maybe, possibly, even enraged?) at the simple thought that someone might direct sexual thoughts or desires toward you.

Yes, I find my sensation of another person's interest upsetting, stressful and difficult to deal with. I become defensive and I want my space, some distance away from the person and the situation in which the attraction happened. I don't feel anything like bitter rage. My inclinations are more defensive than aggressive. I would not strike out at anyone who was interested in my, but I would brush a hand away. I cringe or wince often when I'm touched. The people who are acquainted with me and become friendly sense my need for distance. There are times when a friend will say to me, "I want to give you a hug." And I answer, "That's all right, go ahead." And then I get a hug and that's so nice. Nice from beginning, from being asked to getting it. I don't like silent and facile violations of my personal space, of my body. Kissing is a violation. Yes it is, to me. I don't hate people, but I want them to understand that. And really, the vast majority, men and women, do.

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Hi again Sarae. You seem to be the only person who wants to reply to me on this board. I actually am on SSI so if you need any support let me know I'd be happy to help you in any way I can by offering my own experiences or advice.

Sarae Montgomery <sarmnstr@e...> wrote:*nod* bipolar alone is enough to make most guys cross you off their list. (Bipolar type II w/psychosis, OCD, GAD and a few other malfunctions added in for good flavour). I'm going to be faced with a major decision within the next year and a half... try to get SSDI (i hate having to prove that i'm fucked up) or get married and get on his insurance. I'm in a good relationship (other than the sex thing)... but i can't decide what's worse, rushing into things... or trying to come up with $2000/mo for medication on top of living expenses... -s

---

Sarae Montgomery We're all mad here!

From

"Deidre R." <cowgirldeebop@y...>

To

<[email protected]>

Sent

Wednesday, January 07, 2004 1:23 AM

Subject

Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] Re: Where's the line?

I agree. My recent decision to become celibate has been based on all of those events in my life. One I failed to mention was being with the man who gave me HPV for a year and half before finding out he was married, before I knew what hit me he was in California with his wife. I put two and two together... They were married 3 years, he was making me his mistress without my knowledge or permission for half of his marriage. He was also sleeping with half of Central Ohio during that last year and a half as well. My next fear is that no one will accept my decision, or want have any sort of relationship with me because of my celibacy. Not only do I have to struggle with the acceptance of my HPV, and my disability, (I'm on disability for bipolar, ADHD, borderline personality disorder, and agoraphobia.) but I'm also a big girl, or BBW as we like to say, Big Beautiful Woman. So all in all, I'm not exactly every Ken's Barbie.

Sarae Montgomery <sarmnstr@e...> wrote:fairly similar story here... molested by grandfather at 2 and 8, didn't trust anyone until i was 17... then the guy he went and tried the exact same shit my grandfather did (he was recently accused of rape and is quite a dangerous figure in my life, but he's realising that I won't put up with any of that anymore. Being used 3 times is 3 times too many and it ended there with him). I'm still learning how to trust, but i'm about to just give up hope. I've been in the same relationship for over 2 years... and if we could just remove the whole sex thing, it would be damn near perfect. If only. I feel bad, but still recoil even at close friends and relatives. it's no wonder. there will be times that i can't stand the touch/sound of someone making contact with me and I just want to crawl out of my skin... I don't know how to assure them that it's not them, it's their actions and my sometimes over-sensitive senses... the drawing away is not because I don't like them as a whole. if only this life thing were easier. -s

---

Sarae Montgomery We're all mad here!

From

"Deidre R." <cowgirldeebop@y...>

To

<[email protected]>

Sent

Wednesday, January 07, 2004 12:29 AM

Subject

Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] Re: Where's the line?

I've discovered that all my bad experiences sexually related to my current place in life has caused me to lash out agressively at anyone who shows sexual or romantic interest in me. It could be attributed to a lot of things.. my grandpa raping my cousin, being cheated on or otherwise vexed in every attempted romantic relationship, being diagnosed with HPV. I associate the affection with the bad. And thus instantly recoil and become aggressive, and at times defensive, often getting sick to my stomach. I've even recoiled from my own mothers touch before, and felt horrible for doing it after seeing the look on her face...

elizabeth_burns2003 <burnsei@n...> wrote:--- In [email protected], "elizabeth_burns2003"

burnsei@n... said:

When someone is interested in me, and I sense it, I feel oppressed. I feel like the air around me just got several pounds of pressure added to it. Being noticed is extremely stressful in my case.

Gelf@p... said:

Hmm, I've been noticing an interesting thing here - its not just that you're not interested in sex, it seems you're really seriously upset (maybe, possibly, even enraged?) at the simple thought that someone might direct sexual thoughts or desires toward you.

Yes, I find my sensation of another person's interest upsetting, stressful and difficult to deal with. I become defensive and I want my space, some distance away from the person and the situation in which the attraction happened. I don't feel anything like bitter rage. My inclinations are more defensive than aggressive. I would not strike out at anyone who was interested in my, but I would brush a hand away. I cringe or wince often when I'm touched. The people who are acquainted with me and become friendly sense my need for distance. There are times when a friend will say to me, "I want to give you a hug." And I answer, "That's all right, go ahead." And then I get a hug and that's so nice. Nice from beginning, from being asked to getting it. I don't like silent and facile violations of my personal space, of my body. Kissing is a violation. Yes it is, to me. I don't hate people, but I want them to understand that. And really, the vast majority, men and women, do.

---

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Being looked at by anyone, sometimes in a sexual or even non-sexual manner, being hit on, just being noticed as you said, makes me want to hide my face, cry, and run for cover. I'm not real sure how I ended up this way... People obsessed with sex, who can't hold a conversation without resorting to talk of sex, or who can't look at a relationship in a non sexual manner, just repulse me and frustrate me anymore. elizabeth_burns2003 <burnsei@...> wrote:--- In [email protected], "Deidre R."

Hi again Sarae. You seem to be the only person who wants to reply to me on this board. I actually am on SSI so if you need any support let me know I'd be happy to help you in any way I can by offering my own experiences or advice.

Sarae Montgomery <sarmnstr@e...> wrote:*nod* bipolar alone is enough to make most guys cross you off their list. (Bipolar type II w/psychosis, OCD, GAD and a few other malfunctions added in for good flavour). I'm going to be faced with a major decision within the next year and a half... try to get SSDI (i hate having to prove that i'm fucked up) or get married and get on his insurance. I'm in a good relationship (other than the sex thing)... but i can't decide what's worse, rushing into things... or trying to come up with $2000/mo for medication on top of living expenses... -s

---

Sarae Montgomery We're all mad here!

From

"Deidre R." <cowgirldeebop@y...>

To

<[email protected]>

Sent

Wednesday, January 07, 2004 1:23 AM

Subject

Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] Re: Where's the line?

I agree. My recent decision to become celibate has been based on all of those events in my life. One I failed to mention was being with the man who gave me HPV for a year and half before finding out he was married, before I knew what hit me he was in California with his wife. I put two and two together... They were married 3 years, he was making me his mistress without my knowledge or permission for half of his marriage. He was also sleeping with half of Central Ohio during that last year and a half as well. My next fear is that no one will accept my decision, or want have any sort of relationship with me because of my celibacy. Not only do I have to struggle with the acceptance of my HPV, and my disability, (I'm on disability for bipolar, ADHD, borderline personality disorder, and agoraphobia.) but I'm also a big girl, or BBW as we like to say, Big Beautiful Woman. So all in all, I'm not exactly every Ken's Barbie.

Sarae Montgomery <sarmnstr@e...> wrote:fairly similar story here... molested by grandfather at 2 and 8, didn't trust anyone until i was 17... then the guy he went and tried the exact same shit my grandfather did (he was recently accused of rape and is quite a dangerous figure in my life, but he's realising that I won't put up with any of that anymore. Being used 3 times is 3 times too many and it ended there with him). I'm still learning how to trust, but i'm about to just give up hope. I've been in the same relationship for over 2 years... and if we could just remove the whole sex thing, it would be damn near perfect. If only. I feel bad, but still recoil even at close friends and relatives. it's no wonder. there will be times that i can't stand the touch/sound of someone making contact with me and I just want to crawl out of my skin... I don't know how to assure them that it's not them, it's their actions and my sometimes over-sensitive senses... the drawing away is not because I don't like them as a whole. if only this life thing were easier. -s

---

Sarae Montgomery We're all mad here!

From

"Deidre R." <cowgirldeebop@y...>

To

<[email protected]>

Sent

Wednesday, January 07, 2004 12:29 AM

Subject

Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] Re: Where's the line?

I've discovered that all my bad experiences sexually related to my current place in life has caused me to lash out agressively at anyone who shows sexual or romantic interest in me. It could be attributed to a lot of things.. my grandpa raping my cousin, being cheated on or otherwise vexed in every attempted romantic relationship, being diagnosed with HPV. I associate the affection with the bad. And thus instantly recoil and become aggressive, and at times defensive, often getting sick to my stomach. I've even recoiled from my own mothers touch before, and felt horrible for doing it after seeing the look on her face...

elizabeth_burns2003 <burnsei@n...> wrote:--- In [email protected], "elizabeth_burns2003"

burnsei@n... said:

When someone is interested in me, and I sense it, I feel oppressed. I feel like the air around me just got several pounds of pressure added to it. Being noticed is extremely stressful in my case.

Gelf@p... said:

Hmm, I've been noticing an interesting thing here - its not just that you're not interested in sex, it seems you're really seriously upset (maybe, possibly, even enraged?) at the simple thought that someone might direct sexual thoughts or desires toward you.

Yes, I find my sensation of another person's interest upsetting, stressful and difficult to deal with. I become defensive and I want my space, some distance away from the person and the situation in which the attraction happened. I don't feel anything like bitter rage. My inclinations are more defensive than aggressive. I would not strike out at anyone who was interested in my, but I would brush a hand away. I cringe or wince often when I'm touched. The people who are acquainted with me and become friendly sense my need for distance. There are times when a friend will say to me, "I want to give you a hug." And I answer, "That's all right, go ahead." And then I get a hug and that's so nice. Nice from beginning, from being asked to getting it. I don't like silent and facile violations of my personal space, of my body. Kissing is a violation. Yes it is, to me. I don't hate people, but I want them to understand that. And really, the vast majority, men and women, do.

---

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A lot of that is probably shyness. As for people obssessed with sex, I have no trouble with conversations that deal with sex as a topic. What I have trouble with is how facile people are about asking questions about what my sexual experiences have been. I'm a woman, and frequently, other women think that they have some unwritten right to share my recollections of sexual experiences. Remember the taped conversations between Monica Lewinsky and Linda Tripp? Those were conversations that many women have- and one of the controversies that arose over the taping was between women friends. If Tripp taped those conversations about sex, then was any woman safe in her friendships? Whenever I'm invited to join in any of these "bull" or cow sessions if you will, I stay quiet. If I told them that kissing felt like a violation, and that I had to be partially inebriated or tranquilized to complete the sexual act they'd probably look at me with gaping lips and staring eyes. I don't mind emotional or intellectual intimacy or just spending time with someone at all. But not all intimacy is sexual or even about sex. There is much to be said about just sharing the moment. I've even experienced physical intimacy just by swimming or doing rowing exercises with my friends. They say I have great form.

Being looked at by anyone, sometimes in a sexual or even non-sexual manner, being hit on, just being noticed as you said, makes me want to hide my face, cry, and run for cover. I'm not real sure how I ended up this way... People obsessed with sex, who can't hold a conversation without resorting to talk of sex, or who can't look at a relationship in a non sexual manner, just repulse me and frustrate me anymore. elizabeth_burns2003 <burnsei@n...> wrote:--- In [email protected], "Deidre R."

cowgirldeebop@y... said:

Hi again Sarae. You seem to be the only person who wants to reply to me on this board. I actually am on SSI so if you need any support let me know I'd be happy to help you in any way I can by offering my own experiences or advice.

Sarae Montgomery <sarmnstr@e...> wrote:*nod* bipolar alone is enough to make most guys cross you off their list. (Bipolar type II w/psychosis, OCD, GAD and a few other malfunctions added in for good flavour). I'm going to be faced with a major decision within the next year and a half... try to get SSDI (i hate having to prove that i'm fucked up) or get married and get on his insurance. I'm in a good relationship (other than the sex thing)... but i can't decide what's worse, rushing into things... or trying to come up with $2000/mo for medication on top of living expenses... -s

---

Sarae Montgomery We're all mad here!

From

"Deidre R." <cowgirldeebop@y...>

To

<[email protected]>

Sent

Wednesday, January 07, 2004 1:23 AM

Subject

Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] Re: Where's the line?

I agree. My recent decision to become celibate has been based on all of those events in my life. One I failed to mention was being with the man who gave me HPV for a year and half before finding out he was married, before I knew what hit me he was in California with his wife. I put two and two together... They were married 3 years, he was making me his mistress without my knowledge or permission for half of his marriage. He was also sleeping with half of Central Ohio during that last year and a half as well. My next fear is that no one will accept my decision, or want have any sort of relationship with me because of my celibacy. Not only do I have to struggle with the acceptance of my HPV, and my disability, (I'm on disability for bipolar, ADHD, borderline personality disorder, and agoraphobia.) but I'm also a big girl, or BBW as we like to say, Big Beautiful Woman. So all in all, I'm not exactly every Ken's Barbie.

Sarae Montgomery <sarmnstr@e...> wrote:fairly similar story here... molested by grandfather at 2 and 8, didn't trust anyone until i was 17... then the guy he went and tried the exact same shit my grandfather did (he was recently accused of rape and is quite a dangerous figure in my life, but he's realising that I won't put up with any of that anymore. Being used 3 times is 3 times too many and it ended there with him). I'm still learning how to trust, but i'm about to just give up hope. I've been in the same relationship for over 2 years... and if we could just remove the whole sex thing, it would be damn near perfect. If only. I feel bad, but still recoil even at close friends and relatives. it's no wonder. there will be times that i can't stand the touch/sound of someone making contact with me and I just want to crawl out of my skin... I don't know how to assure them that it's not them, it's their actions and my sometimes over-sensitive senses... the drawing away is not because I don't like them as a whole. if only this life thing were easier. -s

---

Sarae Montgomery We're all mad here!

From

"Deidre R." <cowgirldeebop@y...>

To

<[email protected]>

Sent

Wednesday, January 07, 2004 12:29 AM

Subject

Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] Re: Where's the line?

I've discovered that all my bad experiences sexually related to my current place in life has caused me to lash out agressively at anyone who shows sexual or romantic interest in me. It could be attributed to a lot of things.. my grandpa raping my cousin, being cheated on or otherwise vexed in every attempted romantic relationship, being diagnosed with HPV. I associate the affection with the bad. And thus instantly recoil and become aggressive, and at times defensive, often getting sick to my stomach. I've even recoiled from my own mothers touch before, and felt horrible for doing it after seeing the look on her face...

elizabeth_burns2003 <burnsei@n...> wrote:--- In [email protected], "elizabeth_burns2003"

burnsei@n... said:

When someone is interested in me, and I sense it, I feel oppressed. I feel like the air around me just got several pounds of pressure added to it. Being noticed is extremely stressful in my case.

Gelf@p... said:

Hmm, I've been noticing an interesting thing here - its not just that you're not interested in sex, it seems you're really seriously upset (maybe, possibly, even enraged?) at the simple thought that someone might direct sexual thoughts or desires toward you.

Yes, I find my sensation of another person's interest upsetting, stressful and difficult to deal with. I become defensive and I want my space, some distance away from the person and the situation in which the attraction happened. I don't feel anything like bitter rage. My inclinations are more defensive than aggressive. I would not strike out at anyone who was interested in my, but I would brush a hand away. I cringe or wince often when I'm touched. The people who are acquainted with me and become friendly sense my need for distance. There are times when a friend will say to me, "I want to give you a hug." And I answer, "That's all right, go ahead." And then I get a hug and that's so nice. Nice from beginning, from being asked to getting it. I don't like silent and facile violations of my personal space, of my body. Kissing is a violation. Yes it is, to me. I don't hate people, but I want them to understand that. And really, the vast majority, men and women, do.

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I haven't had the chance to read Brave New World yet. I'd really like to. And as for sex in the hierarchy of concerns, for me it is personally unimportant because I just don't want it. Fortunately in the present, I don't have to deal with anyone's obssession with it. I have had to in the past, though.

This is actually one of my big problems with 1984. Orwell puts forth that orgasm can't be controlled by the state, so it has to be eliminated. Ograsm, according to Orwell, is the fountain from which the magic of human intimacy flows, and that intimacy poses some threat to the state's hegemony.

Really the state in 1984 is anti-intimate, Orwell just assumes (as many people have) that intimacy and sexuality can be equated. People cold swim in endorphines 'till the cows come home (Brave New World) and it wouldn't pose any intrinsic threat to Oceania. What would pose a threat is for people to receieve safety and security from any source other than the state.

Antisexuality assumes that sex is bad because sex is somehow intrinsically important. To an extent this is true (some sex produces babies, spreads STDs, and most sex is somehow pleasurable). Sex positivism assumes the same thing. Is it possible that someone can consider sex, in their lives, to be intrinsically UNIMPORTANT, to feel like sex is unappealing but not particularely repulsive. To use your (I think) earlier example, if someone becomes sexually obsessed with what's unnerving isn't the fact that there is sexual activity being proposed (what's so special about sexual activity?) but rather the emphasis and importance that's being places on that activity. It would be much the same if someone came up to them with an obsessive desire to play soccer.

Hope this makes some sense,

-Dj

On 7 Jan 2004, elizabeth_burns2003 said:

If the repulsion to sex is antisexuality, then I'm very surprised no one brings up George Orwell's Nineteen-Eighty-Four. When I think of antisexuality, this is really the only cultural reference I have for it, and the only way in which I relate to it.

In the third chapter, Winston has a sort of vision of a place called the Golden Country, in which he sees this.

"The girl with dark hair was coming towards them across the field. With what seemed a single movement she tore off her clothes and flung them disdainfully aside. Her body was white and smooth, but it aroused no desire in him, indeed he barely looked at it. What overwhelmed him in that instant was admiration for the gesture with which she had thrown her clothes aside. With its grace and carelessness it seemed to annihilate a whole culture, a whole system of thought, as though Big Brother and the Party and the Thought Police could all be swept into nothingness by a single splendid movement of the arm. That too was a gesture belonging to the ancient time. Winston woke up with the word 'Shakespeare' on his lips."

http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984/3/

This particular vision is not wholly sexual, but makes the point that the antisexuality that serves the state is artifice, and this artifice is designed not to work around nature but against it. It is meant, in fact, to destroy nature. I do not believe that sex is repulsive for my fellow human beings, and I desire no such social construction of it in opposition to nature. Whatever repulsion I have, it is personal and affects only me. It is not meant to serve any state, agenda, or religious purpose.

"When he had gone with that woman it had been his first lapse in two years or thereabouts. Consorting with prostitutes was forbidden, of course, but it was one of those rules that you could occasionally nerve yourself to break. It was dangerous, but it was not a life- and- death matter[...]The aim of the Party was not merely to prevent men and women from forming loyalties which it might not be able to control. Its real, undeclared purpose was to remove all pleasure from the sexual act. Not love so much as eroticism was the enemy, inside marriage as well as outside it."

In the end, the state of Oceania doesn't really fear the sex, but the orgasm itself, the sharing of it, and the connection it brings about between two people as something to which the state and its aims will be made subservient. So according to Orwell, it is the orgasm that facilitates a cemented relationship between mates, and ultimately, between families. It is right that the aims of the state or religion be made subservient to the connection, physical or otherwise, of mates. Have you ever heard the appellation, "Eros, builder of cities?" It's something that human intuition tells us, and I think this name for Eros is correct. Oceania has embraced antisexuality- and with it constant want and war.

Look at the antisexuality of our own times served up generously from the Concerned Women for America or the Lahaye Institute. I tell you, these harpies be the death of us because they teach not just hatred of gays, but hatred of the loyalty between those who love no matter what, and first of all, the hatred of individual integrity. The Concerned Women for America are probably not themselves repulsed by sex, but they have worked toward the end of making sex a social construction, taking it away from the individual, away from lovers, away from integrity and blameless nature.

And of course, as they become more powerful, we tread the path toward constant want and war.

This is the essence of antisexuality to me- the artifice attempting to destroy nature. I don't think my recoiling or seeking distance is unnatural.

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I just read an interesting book about a disorder called sensory defensiveness that encompasses extreme sensitivity in any or all of the five senses. Some previous posts included people discussing recoiling from a touch, even from a family member. This is not as rare as one might think. A lot of what the book covered rang true with me, I have sensitivity to light and sound as well as touch. If someone touches me unexpectedly, I either react in a way people do not find acceptable or I manage to control my reaction while dying inside until they stop touching me.

Some of the other signs of sensory defensiveness included the inablility to stand certain types of motion or being inverted, an extreme fear of heights, or avoiding certain types of food for reasons other than taste or allergy. If you would like to read the book, it is called, 'Too Loud, Too Bright, Too Fast, Too Tight' by Sharon Heller. The reason why I brought this up is that I started to wonder if there was any connection between the sensory defensiveness and asexuality. The disorder can affect people in sexual ways, but I'm not going to get into all of that. If anyone else out there thinks they might have an oversensitivity to anything, feel free to share your experiences. It would be interesting to see if we can draw some conclusions about this subject in a diverse forum such as this.

If anyone else out there thinks they might have an oversensitivity to anything, feel free to share your experiences. It would be interesting to see if we can draw some conclusions about this subject in a diverse forum such as this.

Well, I have a poor sense of balance so I am afraid of being in high places to the extent that if I am near a high ledge or similar places, I get a feeling of vertigo. But I think that's a normal reaction to a real danger, ie. potential for loss of balance and thus harm.

The issue of touch is an interesting one. I have learned that if I don't get touched for a long time, I develop more sensitivity to it than if I have someone touching me daily, providing it's someone that I like. So I think some kinds of sensitivity can be "desensitized" in at least some people, but it takes time and patience.

Therese Shellabarger / The Roving Reporter - Civis Mundi tlshell@... / http://tlshell.cnc.net/

When I taste honey, I can tell what kind of flowers it came from. I can feel dust on a countertop. I can hear 360 degrees around me, and so I can cross streets safely. My sense of balance is sometimes bad, but this is a retinopathic symptom. I can feel when a subtle wind contacts the house. No bowl of oatmeal I eat tastes like the other. I can focus my hearing into rooms off a hallway when I'm sitting in the hallway and the doors are half-ajar. I do this in order to locate people. I remember every identified voice I hear more than twice. I think sensory defensiveness is a necessary condition of the visually impaired.

On 7 Jan 2003, 07:43 +00:00, empfindsamer_stil said:

If anyone else out there thinks they might have an oversensitivity to anything, feel free to share your experiences. It would be interesting to see if we can draw some conclusions about this subject in a diverse forum such as this.

Well, I have a poor sense of balance so I am afraid of being in high places to the extent that if I am near a high ledge or similar places, I get a feeling of vertigo. But I think that's a normal reaction to a real danger, ie. potential for loss of balance and thus harm.

The issue of touch is an interesting one. I have learned that if I don't get touched for a long time, I develop more sensitivity to it than if I have someone touching me daily, providing it's someone that I like. So I think some kinds of sensitivity can be "desensitized" in at least some people, but it takes time and patience.

---

Therese Shellabarger / The Roving Reporter - Civis Mundi tlshell@c... / http://tlshell.cnc.net/

I have a very close friend who has HPV who has found many ways to express his sexuality and has recently found a partner. If you'd like some of his resourses please e-mail me off list.

Autumn

[email protected] wrote:

Hi, My name is Deidre. I'm 20 yrs old, and I live in Central Ohio. Lately I wonder if asexuality is my best bet... I've recently discovered that I am HPV Positive. (HPV being genital warts.) I feel like a broken doll, no one wants me anymore. Everything is so sexually based anymore... From the media, to television, to people intentions. I can't say I don't have sexual urges. But sex has led to every traumatizing thing to happen in my life... If anyone would like to chat feel free to IM me at CowgirlDeebop on either Yahoo! or AOL. -Deidre

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I am so glad to have finally found that I am not alone w/ this and not crazy. I'm extremely sensitive to so many things; light, sound, etc. I never open my blinds or windows due to light and sound. The ringing of the telephone makes me jump. I get startled very easily. The one thing that drives me really crazy, is the feel of anything touching my body such as my hair..which I just cut real short and clothes touching me too tightly. I always wear big baggy clothes. Every night at 9pm, my neighbor blasts his stereo for an hour w/ the base booming through my walls. Sometimes I just want to do something to this guy. I have called the police..not much help. I do take anti-anxiety medications, but they don't seem to help w/ these issues. I never thought of it before, but could this be more than just sensory defensiveness? I'm wondering now how this might affect sexual/intimate touching. I'm so glad this subject was brought up and posted. I hope to find some answers or relief in other member's posts.

Thanks, Reesa

I just read an interesting book about a disorder called sensory defensiveness that encompasses extreme sensitivity in any or all of the five senses. Some previous posts included people discussing recoiling from a touch, even from a family member. This is not as rare as one might think. A lot of what the book covered rang true with me, I have sensitivity to light and sound as well as touch. If someone touches me unexpectedly, I either react in a way people do not find acceptable or I manage to control my reaction while dying inside until they stop touching me.

Some of the other signs of sensory defensiveness included the inablility to stand certain types of motion or being inverted, an extreme fear of heights, or avoiding certain types of food for reasons other than taste or allergy. If you would like to read the book, it is called, 'Too Loud, Too Bright, Too Fast, Too Tight' by Sharon Heller. The reason why I brought this up is that I started to wonder if there was any connection between the sensory defensiveness and asexuality. The disorder can affect people in sexual ways, but I'm not going to get into all of that. If anyone else out there thinks they might have an oversensitivity to anything, feel free to share your experiences. It would be interesting to see if we can draw some conclusions about this subject in a diverse forum such as this.

I'm extremely sensitive to so many things; light, sound, etc. I never open my blinds or windows due to light and sound. The ringing of the telephone makes me jump. I get startled very easily. The one thing that drives me really crazy, is the feel of anything touching my body such as my hair..which I just cut real short and clothes touching me too tightly. I always wear big baggy clothes.

Wow, you bring up whole other areas I had never thought of. 1. I have a hard time in crowds 2. I don't like most utilitarian sounds (cars, vacuum cleaners, toilet flush, buzzing noises...) so I don't wear my hearing aids unless I actually need them for communication at work, with relatives, etc., or safety reasons at work. 3. I also startle easily, which is why I am glad I finally "trained" my dad to flash the light switch before entering a room where I haven't seen him and he wants to talk to me. 4. I swear, I will kill the next person who tries to tickle me in any way. (Hasn't been tried in years though, so my "anxiety level" has improved a lot on this topic.) 5. I also keep my hair short because it drives me nuts if it gets on my face. 6. I like comfortable clothes and that translates to slightly baggy as well.

Every night at 9pm, my neighbor blasts his stereo for an hour w/ the base booming through my walls.

Now this one, I have not experienced. I guess being hard of hearing has been a secret blessing for me...the only problem I have at night is that the apartment is under a local flight path (small planes, Fedex delivery planes, "puddle jumpers" and the like), so sometimes if they fly low, I feel the vibrations as though I am experiencing an earthquake. Since I live in California, it took me awhile to figure out what was *really* going on. Fortunately, I have hanging plants in my apartment so if they are not moving about, then I know it's not an earthquake.

BTW, I'm really amazed at what some blind people experience as reported in this group...particularly the ability to localize people as to which room they are in!

Therese Shellabarger / The Roving Reporter - Civis Mundi tlshell@... / http://tlshell.cnc.net/

Will we still be the Country of choice and still be America if we continue to make the changes forced on us by the people from other countries that came to live in America because it is the Country of Choice??? Think about it . . .

All I have to say is, when will they do something about MY RIGHTS? I celebrate Christmas, but because it isn't celebrated by everyone, we can no longer say Merry Christmas. Now it has to be Season's Greetings. It's not Christmas vacation, it's Winter Break. Isn't it amazing how this winter break ALWAYS occurs over the Christmas holiday? We've gone so far the other way, bent over backwards to not offend anyone, that I am now being offended. But it seems that no one has a problem with that.

This says it all!

This is an editorial written by an American citizen, published in a Tampa Newspaper. He did quite a job, didn't he? Read on, please!

IMMIGRANTS, NOT AMERICANS, MUST ADAPT.

I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Sept. 11, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by The majority of Americans. However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when the "politically correct" crowd began complaining about the possibility that our patriotism was offending others.

I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to America. Our population is almost entirely made up of descendants of immigrants. However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand. This idea of America being a multicultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. As Americans, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle. This culture has been developed over centuries of struggles, trials, and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom.

We speak ENGLISH, not Spanish, Portuguese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society, learn the language!

"In God We Trust" is our national motto. This is not some Christian, right wing, political slogan. We adopted this motto because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, because God is part of our culture.

If Stars and Stripes offend you, or you don't like Uncle Sam, then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet. We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we really don't care how you did things where you came from. This is OUR COUNTRY, our land, and our lifestyle. Our First Amendment gives every citizen the right to express his opinion and we will allow you every opportunity to do so. But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about our flag, our pledge, our national motto, or our way of life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great American freedom, THE RIGHT TO LEAVE.

If you agree -- pass this along; if you don't agree -- delete it

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All I have to say is, when will they do something about MY RIGHTS? I celebrate Christmas, but because it isn't celebrated by everyone, we can no longer say Merry Christmas. Now it has to be Season's Greetings. It's not Christmas vacation, it's Winter Break. Isn't it amazing how this winter break ALWAYS occurs over the Christmas holiday? We've gone so far the other way, bent over backwards to not offend anyone, that I am now being offended. But it seems that no one has a problem with that.

I cringe when someone says "Merry Christmas" to me because they are assuming (wrongly) that it's also my holiday. I am much happier with a generic greeting that is all-inclusive.

However, if you *really* want a native holiday greeting, how about asking what the American Indians that met Columbus would have said?

The fact that "Winter Break" is during the Christmas season is a compromise because Jews and Muslims use a lunar calendar with holidays varying on the solar calendar from year to year. In that sense, it's much like daylike savings time; regions on the border of each time zone aren't quite on target either.

The U.S. is changing and in this instance, I think that's a good thing because, finally, minorities are being heard too.

Therese Shellabarger / The Roving Reporter - Civis Mundi tlshell@... / http://tlshell.cnc.net/