[Haven for the Human Amoeba] Re: "Sexual Anorexia"???!!!
Actually, the physical renditions are often done after medication and there are persuasive arguments that the differences between the brain of a mentally "ill" person and others is actually caused by the medication.
Where are your sources, and what are the dates on them? All of the modern comparisons that I have seen are before/after type scenarios where the final "product" compares the brain pretty closely to what a non-effected brain looks like. If medication created the difference, then how exactly did it cause it to return to a normal image years/months later?
It should also be noted that in some cases, medication is not necessary to produce differences. Jeffrey Schwartz' work with OCD in fact advocates *not* seeing a therapist except in the more extreme varieties of it. His cases show dramatic differences between imaging before and after, without medication. This shows that large scale changes in the structure of the brain can be altered through solo mental technique alone. It also shows that your assertion has less global merit, since it relies upon the specific alterations of post-medication examination.
If you've done any research into psychosomatic illness (such as common hay fever,) and mental healing, this shouldn't come as a surprise.
Medication can produce results, but the camps are divided on how well it works. With some people, it works perfectly, and once they are off they live a liberated life, swearing by their treatment. With others, it does nothing but misery, and their only choice is to use them their entire lives to get marginal gain, or just stop using them altogether and go back to the way they were.
So essentially if a creature doesn't act as one would assume it should, it is mentally ill? Sounds like imposing behaviors upon others...
When a cat has hyperesthesia, or a dog consistently pulls its hair out in patches until it bleeds -- with no evidence of any skin conditions or nerve disorders, or other ordinary reasons that animals do this -- they have a problem. Does the problem exist in the mind of the beholder, imposing its view, or does the problem exist in the mind of the animal? Which is more likely?
Additionally, your line of reasoning does not hold beyond its application. Are all sicknesses then suspect to imposed abnormalities, since they are nothing more than deviations from the assumed norm?
Have you? And was this individual (or you) treated voluntarily or against his/her/your will?
To the first question, yes. Both myself and my ex-girlfriend. The intensity of her problems were caused by a rare, and severe hormonal imbalance. For myself, I have yet to find a cause, I've been as I am, for as far back as I can remember. As far as I know, I was born this way.
To the second question, no. Both of us felt strongly against typical therapy, and resolved to overcome our problems with homeopathic remedies, and our own mutual support (with the obvious exception of her medical problems, as it required surgery. They affected the intensity, not the basis.) Today, her issues still exist, but she has mentally overcome them. Instead of fighting against them, she's found a way to live with them. While I am not completely to that point yet, I am making progress as well. It is important to note that the malfunctions still exist in my brain. I am just learning how to embrace them, and use them as an asset in my life. Something you won't find many traditionally schooled psychologists supporting.
The point is, the illness is real. I can poke at it, trigger it, and even play with it from time to time. Other times, I forget myself, and I wake up one morning realizing that the past five months have been destroyed by it.
I have yet to meet anyone being treated against their wills that have anything positive to say about therapy. I will concede though that my age group (that is teenagers) is more likely to be considered "at- risk" over more minor things and have our confidentiality broken, making it significantly more likely that my friends and I will hold a grudge.
I've yet to meet anyone beyond childhood who has to do *anything* against their will have overly positive things to say about the process that they went through. That line of thought is a straw man. On this topic though, I will reiterate my earlier point. I hold no favor for the psychological industry, and it is an industry. They have probably ruined as many lives as they have helped. The reason for that is, as I said before, their tactics. Putting people through a system against their will has base merit in some cases, but is taken way out of context and applied to almost all forms of mental disorder, as a mandate against individuality -- as you put it.
The industry is has not created an image for itself that causes anyone to coo lovingly. Psychologists are often uttered in the same disdainful breath as lawyers, for a good reason. They have a noble task, but in both cases they, the *common* members of their cabal, have warped and abused their power beyond all recognition.
On this topic, I believe we are in accord. The community is shifting, thank goodness, but the shift is currently hard to find. The ones who practice natural remedies, cognitive behavioral therapy, and a very limited approach to medication (if at all) are still harder to find, but their success and findings is having a large impact on the body of psychology itself.
As an interesting side-note, these remedies are not new. In fact they are very old. They all but died in the early 1900s, despite the successes they were beginning to have, thanks to the psychotherapy movement, which to this day has yet to produce any statistically impressive results. It is also this psychotherapeutic model and its derivatives that receive the criticism of you and I.
A difficulty isn't a disease.
I made a clear distinction between the two in an earlier paragraph, so I do not see the relevance of this retort. It can be conveniently flipped though: A disease is a difficulty (but I am planting my tongue in my cheek at this point. I love flipping axioms too. :)
.:.
Where are your sources, and what are the dates on them? The May/June 2002 issue of Adbusters as well as a few articles in a book published this year edited by Russ Kick entitled "Everything You Know Is Wrong" (okay, paranoid source but I tend to believe them) both made this argument. Internet sources tend to be older but exist and while I don't know the date of its publication, _Manufacturing Victims_ by Dineen was fairly good. By the by, are you familiar with the psychologists of the sixties? All of the modern comparisons that I have seen are before/after type scenarios where the final "product" compares the brain pretty closely to what a non-effected brain looks like. If medication created the difference, then how exactly did it cause it to return to a normal image years/months later? First and foremost, I do not see abnormality as disease. A disease is something that happens to a person against their will. Consciousness is the "essence" of a person and his/her actions are an extension of that will. However, simply to entertain this thought, medication may not have created the difference, if moods and beliefs are seen as influenced by the outside world. A depressed person no longer using an anti-depressant may have a normal image years laters because the brain healed from the medication and the individual has grown in such ways that the "sick" beliefs and the situation creating it no longer exists. However, even by the admittance of psychiatrists I have heard that have been submitted to medication often never returning to normal brain function. His cases show dramatic differences between imaging before and after, without medication. This shows that large scale changes in the structure of the brain can be altered through solo mental technique alone. It also shows that your assertion has less global merit, since it relies upon the specific alterations of post-medication examination. Chemicals do change moods, but that doesn't prove that there is an illness anymore than it proves that people are depressed if they feel better after a joint. When a cat has hyperesthesia, or a dog consistently pulls its hair out in patches until it bleeds -- with no evidence of any skin conditions or nerve disorders, or other ordinary reasons that animals do this -- they have a problem. I disagree...the *behavior* isn't a problem to the animal, it is the result of its volition. Does the problem exist in the mind of the beholder, imposing its view, or does the problem exist in the mind of the animal? Which is more likely? You are the one imposing the view that it is a problem. The animal of course is provoked by something to act in such a way and believes this behavior will somehow improve its existence. Yet it is the cause, not the behavior, that remains the problem. homeopathic remedies Forgive my ignorance, but what is that? I made a clear distinction between the two in an earlier paragraph, so I do not see the relevance of this retort. It can be conveniently flipped though: A disease is a difficulty (but I am planting my tongue in my cheek at this point. I love flipping axioms too. :) Word games are fun...deconstructionism! --Nothing
Re: "Sexual Anorexia"???!!!
Hi y'all! I've been lurking for a while, but I guess it's time for me to step out of the shadows for a minute. While surfing the 'net, I came across this web page and found it to be interesting:
http://www.sexhelp.com/what_is_sex_anorexia.cfm
I'm not going to sate my opinion about this article yet. Instead, I'm going to give you all a chance to read it first. I'd like to hear your thoughts about it.
I think it's mostly B.S. but it's possible that some suffer from this supposed disorder. However, I don't think that anyone in this group suffers from this or defines themselves in this way. I don't think that's what this group identifies itself with. I abstain from sex because I simply don't desire it. I am a non-religious person and I have absolutely no history of sexual or physical abuse whatsoever.
Hi y'all! I've been lurking for a while, but I guess it's time for me to step out of the shadows for a minute. While surfing the 'net, I came across this web page and found it to be interesting:
http://www.sexhelp.com/what_is_sex_anorexia.cfm
I'm not going to sate my opinion about this article yet. Instead, I'm going to give you all a chance to read it first. I'd like to hear your thoughts about it.
Re: Where's the support?
Hi Kalibrate! Welcome to the Group. I'm sorry that you walked in during another one of our heated discussions. We have a lot of those here, but it's all good. I like to witness (and sometimes participate in) the exchange of ideas between active minds. I think it helps society move forward.
The support you asked about does exist here. Several members have presented the Group with personal issues that they were dealing with and each time (in my opinion), they received open and honest replies. (What are friends for, right?) I posted a message (#610) a while ago during one of our warmer moments. You can search for #610 in the message archive or put keywords (like lonely, alone, depressed, etc.)in the archive search box and locate some really nice, supportive messages.
In the meantime, if you feel that you are asexual, then please pull up a keyboard and plop down here with us in this HAVEN. :)
About your depression, that can get serious. I've battled with Depression for most of my life (for various other reasons, not since discovering my asexuality). I write or draw when I really want to kick the mess out of someone or something that is really bothering me. I'm no Edgar Allen Poe or Picasso, but it sure helps me vent when I need to express myself. Sometimes, I just sit in my room and listen to some of my favorite CDs (even try to sing along). General excercise and long walks help me clear my mind, too. I don't know how light or heavy your depression is, but I do commend you for opening up and sharing that with us. I used to internalize everything so it took me a while to learn how to reach out for help. (I don't know if anything I've said so far has helped you, but I'm trying.)
Stick around! For a bunch of asexuals, we're (ironically) very passionate about certain things. I'm sure that you'll fit in just fine! :)
Hello. I just joined this group after finally admitting that I am asexual. I've known for some time but have only now started to face the postives of knowing where I stand and the negatives of knowing this is where I always stand. A little depressed more than anything. Since I'm new I've missed all the post that probably give the most support. Can someone lead me in the right direction? I so do need help!
Kalibrate
Re: "Sexual Anorexia"???!!!
I think it's mostly B.S. but it's possible that some suffer from this supposed disorder. However, I don't think that anyone in this group suffers from this or defines themselves in this way. I don't think that's what this group identifies itself with. I abstain from sex because I simply don't desire it. I am a non-religious person and I have absolutely no history of sexual or physical abuse whatsoever.
celibbrat said:Hi y'all! I've been lurking for a while, but I guess it's time for me to step out of the shadows for a minute. While surfing the 'net, I came across this web page and found it to be interesting:
http://www.sexhelp.com/what_is_sex_anorexia.cfm
I'm not going to sate my opinion about this article yet. Instead, I'm going to give you all a chance to read it first. I'd like to hear your thoughts about it.
Now I can reply to my "Sexual Anorexia" topic. When I read this article, I had mixed emotions.
On one hand, I felt guilty of the crime the author was accusing me of; being sexually anorexic. These first thirty years of my life have been...basically yucky. I've overcome a lot of crap (no thanks to the so-called "therapists" who were supposed to help me) and I feel pretty good about my life these days. Late last year, I had my *asexual awakening* and started to realize that I am MUCH happier when I'm single.
Ok, so I said all of that to say that I get kind of self-conscious when I read articles like this which express a *clinical* viewpoint of certain behaviors that *post-traumatic, at-risk* -type people would display. For a moment, I would get sucked into the authoritative vaccuum that these types of articles represent. I start thinking, "Damn, maybe they're all right. Maybe I'm just permanently damaged for life and there is no hope for me". Then I think again.
On the other hand, I had to ask myself if I'm really happy now. The answer is YES. Why fix what doesn't feel broken? I tried that relationship roller-coaster thing and it just didn't do it for me. I may never know if I was born asexual or if I was simply nurtured into becoming one. What I do know is that I tried with all of my heart to make sexual relationships work and they just didn't. When I looked back into the "sex" aspect of those relationships, I realized that i only "did it" to please my man. It was never something that I "wanted" to do. Sex to me was sorta like when kids eat (name a vegetable) just to please his/her parents. So I'm happier now that I've quit trying to force that situation upon myself. I have no desire to "go there" again.
After examining my mixed feelings about this article, I've come to the conclusion that I'm not sexually anorexic. I don't obsess about sex. I really do think about a zillion other things during my every day existence. I have experienced a traumatic past, but (as Rafiki said in "The Lion King") it's in the past. I've moved on to much greener pastures and I'm lovin' it! I do actively avoid putting myself into sexual situations. (I don't date anymore.) I get hit on a lot by friends and strangers, but this doesn't make me any different from most people. I think that most people have to turn down solicitations all the time. This article invoked some emotions in me and I thought it might affect some of you, too. Please keep up the discussion about it if you want. Peace.
I think it's mostly B.S. but it's possible that some suffer from this supposed disorder. However, I don't think that anyone in this group suffers from this or defines themselves in this way. I don't think that's what this group identifies itself with. I abstain from sex because I simply don't desire it. I am a non-religious person and I have absolutely no history of sexual or physical abuse whatsoever.
celibbrat said:Hi y'all! I've been lurking for a while, but I guess it's time for me to step out of the shadows for a minute. While surfing the 'net, I came across this web page and found it to be interesting:
http://www.sexhelp.com/what_is_sex_anorexia.cfm
I'm not going to sate my opinion about this article yet. Instead, I'm going to give you all a chance to read it first. I'd like to hear your thoughts about it.
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Re: Interesting article
Here's an interesting article on ceibacy in catholic preists, thought people might want to give it a look...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A2533-2002Jun5.html
IT was interseting
responding to the previous article again: the psychologist or the majority of the population believed that "the minorities must have some kind disorder" they once said that to homosexuals, until they finally learn more about it, they finally get better in my opinion, i think those psychologists have some kinda disorder--- why would something want to study humans? lol one's idea doesn't apply to others, i believe
for this article, it's clearly saying everyone is sexual; what people do is celibrate. Which i think is untrue, cause i really have no desire on sex.
there is one thing get me very mad when they talk about the priest being homosexuals THIS IS UNTRUE. they are simply child mulaster, not homosexuals in a GENERAL study, homosexuals are less likely to become a child mulaster
anyway, asexuality is a new topic, it has yet to be studied before that day, we will just be called the weirdo
p.s. maybe we should start a religion, saying we devoting our lives to public goods (engineers create civiliation)
Here's an interesting article on ceibacy in catholic preists, thought people might want to give it a look...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A2533-2002Jun5.html
Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] Re: Interesting article
IT was interseting
responding to the previous article again: the psychologist or the majority of the population believed that "the minorities must have some kind disorder" they once said that to homosexuals, until they finally learn more about it, they finally get better in my opinion, i think those psychologists have some kinda disorder--- why would something want to study humans? lol one's idea doesn't apply to others, i believe
for this article, it's clearly saying everyone is sexual; what people do is celibrate. Which i think is untrue, cause i really have no desire on sex.
there is one thing get me very mad when they talk about the priest being homosexuals THIS IS UNTRUE. they are simply child mulaster, not homosexuals in a GENERAL study, homosexuals are less likely to become a child mulaster
anyway, asexuality is a new topic, it has yet to be studied before that day, we will just be called the weirdo
p.s. maybe we should start a religion, saying we devoting our lives to public goods (engineers create civiliation)
djay@w... said:Here's an interesting article on ceibacy in catholic preists, thought people might want to give it a look...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A2533-2002Jun5.html
Hehe, I hear you.
The article definitely makes some sexually centered assumptions, but its extremely interesting in terms of guaging what the general public thinks about nonsexuality. The article did not mention abuse directly, but it's obviously in response to the scandal. People blame the abuse on sexually frustrated celibate preists, so the article is trying to explain how celibacy works. It's definitely saying that everyone is sexual, and its drawing a line (though thankfully an extremely indirect one) between gay preists and abuse. What the preists are saying, if you translate it out of catholic-speak, has some interesting paralells to asexuality though. There was one interesting part where they talked about people "giving up marraige" either because they were giving it up to god or because they just weren't born for it. An interesting tacit acknowledgement of asexuality.
On the sexual anorexia schtik...
It seems to me that there's a clear distinction. It's unhealthy to try and force yourself to be sexual in a way you're not. So if you're a sexual person and you have a traumatic experience around sex, then forcing yourself not to be sexual can be unhealthy (you have to be obsessive to maintian it, you can't function socially, etc.) By the same token an asexual person who is forced to be sexual (by social norms) won't be healthy (same way a homosexual person forced to be heterosexual won't.)
-DJ
IT was interseting
responding to the previous article again: the psychologist or the majority of the population believed that "the minorities must have some kind disorder" they once said that to homosexuals, until they finally learn more about it, they finally get better in my opinion, i think those psychologists have some kinda disorder--- why would something want to study humans? lol one's idea doesn't apply to others, i believe
for this article, it's clearly saying everyone is sexual; what people do is celibrate. Which i think is untrue, cause i really have no desire on sex.
there is one thing get me very mad when they talk about the priest being homosexuals THIS IS UNTRUE. they are simply child mulaster, not homosexuals in a GENERAL study, homosexuals are less likely to become a child mulaster
anyway, asexuality is a new topic, it has yet to be studied before that day, we will just be called the weirdo
p.s. maybe we should start a religion, saying we devoting our lives to public goods (engineers create civiliation)
djay@w... said:Here's an interesting article on ceibacy in catholic preists, thought people might want to give it a look...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A2533-2002Jun5.html
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Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] When you wanna stretch her to the limit.
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I would be more inclined to have it removed. Your website does not address this.
lets move
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I would be more inclined to have it removed. Your website does not address this.
the stupid spamming people has come back Dj, have you orangized about moving?
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I would be more inclined to have it removed. Your website does not address this.
Re: Interesting article
Here's an interesting article on ceibacy in catholic preists, thought people might want to give it a look...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A2533-2002Jun5.html
I enjoyed the article but I didn't agree with one statement that "all human beings are sexual beings" because then that would mean that we are all suppressing our sexual feelings and/or sexuality here
Here's an interesting article on ceibacy in catholic preists, thought people might want to give it a look...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A2533-2002Jun5.html
So, it isn't "just a phase" or some weird twist of my mind...
... there are actually people in the world who will believe me when I say I find sex completely disinteresting, that I find both genders of the human species aesthetically lovely at times (I'm an artist) but finds nothing overly appealing about seeing either naked? That I love the idea of friendship and close intimacy, but that sex is unappealing? That it isn't something I'm going to outgrow, or a figment of my imagination, or just failing to meet the right person, or reaction to a particular bad experience?
Wow.
And here I was thinking that "joking" about being asexual was about as far as I could take it. My friends call me the Pope because of my total lack of interest in sex. I don't think the world revolves around it. In fact, there are long stretches of time when it doesn't cross my mind, and when it does it's only because someone else brought it up. I've been told for years that I am imagining this, that I cannot be this way, etc etc. Of course, EVERY human being must be sex-crazed, and if I claim to be otherwise, I must be in denial. Ah, Freud, how I hate what I know of you...
So ... let me get this straight. I'm not crazy. I'm not alone. It's a perfectly valid way to be. It even gets a lovely little name and a creatively titled group. I don't have to feel quite so confused, or give in to pressure for something I don't want.
Wow.
-Selie
It's weird.
Yes. So all of a sudden I have questions, and at the same time a number of questions have been answered. I guess you could say I'm still kind of confused about this. I mean, I'm USED to telling people how I feel and being told that I don't really know how I feel, don't understand what I'm talking about, and will find myself proven wrong, wink wink nudge nudge. Like they know me and my body better than I do. That used to make me so angry and I'd argue back, and they would all give each other these knowing nods... "She'll figure it out. When she gets older, some guy will come and sweep her off her feet. And when she gets older, she'll stop being such a prude." It's like how my mom tells me I'm going to start drinking and at least experiment with drugs, "because everyone else does."
Yeah, maybe it isn't NORMAL - I mean, we're organisms that come in two sexual variations physically, and to keep our species going we reproduce sexually, so it seems reasonable to me that any type of existance beyond that defies at least some property of nature. It's like being suicidal, though; it goes against what one might think is natural, the preservation and continuation of life, but it HAPPENS. So it isn't unnatural, it's just not the norm. This makes sense, right? It's like G/L/B ... I guess? I don't know. But for some reason those are acceptable, except maybe here in the Bible Belt (I know a number of people who have had problems because of that) ... and I'm babbling again. But people don't believe we exist. They can't deny that gay people exist, even if they think that gayness is wrong, blah blah blah - but they just cannot believe that any person in the world can just not have an interest in sex. Is it THAT hard to comprehend?
I guess it is. I can't figure out why people CAN have an interest in it. I talked about this with a friend the other night, before I asked her if she thought asexuality might actually exist and she told me to look it up. And then I found you guys.
It isn't that big a deal, though, is it? It's not like coming out and throwing a party about it or anything, right? It's ... subtle. It's a not-ness, rather than a different-ness... so now I'm confused. Thing is, I still can't tell my family. For one thing, with timing, they would say I'm reacting to a particular experience in my life. For another thing, when I've told them in the past that I don't think about sex or find it interesting, they've laughed at me. But do I tell my friends that I have a name for it and I'm not just weird any more? I don't know.
Is it a big deal?
... my head hurts. I'm sure I'm not making any sense... I've been at work for hours.
I must say, though, that it feels like a burden has been lifted off my shoulders. Before, I felt like I was inevitably going to have to do something I didn't want to. Because relationships are supposed to inevitably lead to that, and people are supposed to be in relationships. But I don't have to do anything I don't want to do, right? And it feels wonderful. I can relax in who I am, and no amount of outside pressure will be able to make me do what I don't want to do ever again, not like this. Because it's okay to be the way I am. I'm not just crazy and it's not just inside my head.
Thanks.
-Selie
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Re: It's weird.
Yes. So all of a sudden I have questions, and at the same time a number of questions have been answered. I guess you could say I'm still kind of confused about this. I mean, I'm USED to telling people how I feel and being told that I don't really know how I feel, don't understand what I'm talking about, and will find myself proven wrong, wink wink nudge nudge. Like they know me and my body better than I do. That used to make me so angry and I'd argue back, and they would all give each other these knowing nods... "She'll figure it out. When she gets older, some guy will come and sweep her off her feet. And when she gets older, she'll stop being such a prude." It's like how my mom tells me I'm going to start drinking and at least experiment with drugs, "because everyone else does."
Yeah, maybe it isn't NORMAL - I mean, we're organisms that come in two sexual variations physically, and to keep our species going we reproduce sexually, so it seems reasonable to me that any type of existance beyond that defies at least some property of nature. It's like being suicidal, though; it goes against what one might think is natural, the preservation and continuation of life, but it HAPPENS. So it isn't unnatural, it's just not the norm. This makes sense, right? It's like G/L/B ... I guess? I don't know. But for some reason those are acceptable, except maybe here in the Bible Belt (I know a number of people who have had problems because of that) ... and I'm babbling again. But people don't believe we exist. They can't deny that gay people exist, even if they think that gayness is wrong, blah blah blah - but they just cannot believe that any person in the world can just not have an interest in sex. Is it THAT hard to comprehend?
I guess it is. I can't figure out why people CAN have an interest in it. I talked about this with a friend the other night, before I asked her if she thought asexuality might actually exist and she told me to look it up. And then I found you guys.
It isn't that big a deal, though, is it? It's not like coming out and throwing a party about it or anything, right? It's ... subtle. It's a not-ness, rather than a different-ness... so now I'm confused. Thing is, I still can't tell my family. For one thing, with timing, they would say I'm reacting to a particular experience in my life. For another thing, when I've told them in the past that I don't think about sex or find it interesting, they've laughed at me. But do I tell my friends that I have a name for it and I'm not just weird any more? I don't know.
Is it a big deal?
... my head hurts. I'm sure I'm not making any sense... I've been at work for hours.
I must say, though, that it feels like a burden has been lifted off my shoulders. Before, I felt like I was inevitably going to have to do something I didn't want to. Because relationships are supposed to inevitably lead to that, and people are supposed to be in relationships. But I don't have to do anything I don't want to do, right? And it feels wonderful. I can relax in who I am, and no amount of outside pressure will be able to make me do what I don't want to do ever again, not like this. Because it's okay to be the way I am. I'm not just crazy and it's not just inside my head.
Thanks.
-Selie
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
hi selie welcome to the club i think i can be called "homo-aseuxal" now, i love girls much more than i like guys i would liek to hold them in my arms, watch stars, blah blah (i know you dont want me to go on) that's it, i dont need anything R rated! to happen to me
what you said, happens to everyone "you will grow out of it" basicly, you meant don't worry, plenty of people told me that, but its clear that i am a "homo-asexual". i know that myself, and i am happy to love all my friends just ignore those people who tells you "you will grow out of it" they just cannot believe asexuals exists just like my parents would think i would grow out of the "tomboy" thing but the fact is it's part of me
listen, asexual exists. if you are one, you will NOT "grow out of it" if you arent one, you will, likewise
you just missed a discussion about "norm and disorder earlier" we were discussing about how the sex therpists think we have a disorder, but the fact is that we dont like it, period. my point is "majority always think minority has problem" i am sure back in those days, the whites thought the blacks have some kind illness to make them black my point is "their ignorance drive them to this conclusion"
asexuality is just being recognised, here. because asexuals come together, and forming a force, asexuals would always be considered as "abnormal"
just ignore what those people tell you (you will grow out and all other bs) follow your heart
francis
Yes. So all of a sudden I have questions, and at the same time a number of questions have been answered. I guess you could say I'm still kind of confused about this. I mean, I'm USED to telling people how I feel and being told that I don't really know how I feel, don't understand what I'm talking about, and will find myself proven wrong, wink wink nudge nudge. Like they know me and my body better than I do. That used to make me so angry and I'd argue back, and they would all give each other these knowing nods... "She'll figure it out. When she gets older, some guy will come and sweep her off her feet. And when she gets older, she'll stop being such a prude." It's like how my mom tells me I'm going to start drinking and at least experiment with drugs, "because everyone else does."
Yeah, maybe it isn't NORMAL - I mean, we're organisms that come in two sexual variations physically, and to keep our species going we reproduce sexually, so it seems reasonable to me that any type of existance beyond that defies at least some property of nature. It's like being suicidal, though; it goes against what one might think is natural, the preservation and continuation of life, but it HAPPENS. So it isn't unnatural, it's just not the norm. This makes sense, right? It's like G/L/B ... I guess? I don't know. But for some reason those are acceptable, except maybe here in the Bible Belt (I know a number of people who have had problems because of that) ... and I'm babbling again. But people don't believe we exist. They can't deny that gay people exist, even if they think that gayness is wrong, blah blah blah - but they just cannot believe that any person in the world can just not have an interest in sex. Is it THAT hard to comprehend?
I guess it is. I can't figure out why people CAN have an interest in it. I talked about this with a friend the other night, before I asked her if she thought asexuality might actually exist and she told me to look it up. And then I found you guys.
It isn't that big a deal, though, is it? It's not like coming out and throwing a party about it or anything, right? It's ... subtle. It's a not-ness, rather than a different-ness... so now I'm confused. Thing is, I still can't tell my family. For one thing, with timing, they would say I'm reacting to a particular experience in my life. For another thing, when I've told them in the past that I don't think about sex or find it interesting, they've laughed at me. But do I tell my friends that I have a name for it and I'm not just weird any more? I don't know.
Is it a big deal?
... my head hurts. I'm sure I'm not making any sense... I've been at work for hours.
I must say, though, that it feels like a burden has been lifted off my shoulders. Before, I felt like I was inevitably going to have to do something I didn't want to. Because relationships are supposed to inevitably lead to that, and people are supposed to be in relationships. But I don't have to do anything I don't want to do, right? And it feels wonderful. I can relax in who I am, and no amount of outside pressure will be able to make me do what I don't want to do ever again, not like this. Because it's okay to be the way I am. I'm not just crazy and it's not just inside my head.
Thanks.
-Selie
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Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] So, it isn't "just a phase" or some weird twist of my mind...
... there are actually people in the world who will believe me when I say I find sex completely disinteresting, that I find both genders of the human species aesthetically lovely at times (I'm an artist) but finds nothing overly appealing about seeing either naked? That I love the idea of friendship and close intimacy, but that sex is unappealing? That it isn't something I'm going to outgrow, or a figment of my imagination, or just failing to meet the right person, or reaction to a particular bad experience?
Wow.
And here I was thinking that "joking" about being asexual was about as far as I could take it. My friends call me the Pope because of my total lack of interest in sex. I don't think the world revolves around it. In fact, there are long stretches of time when it doesn't cross my mind, and when it does it's only because someone else brought it up. I've been told for years that I am imagining this, that I cannot be this way, etc etc. Of course, EVERY human being must be sex-crazed, and if I claim to be otherwise, I must be in denial. Ah, Freud, how I hate what I know of you...
So ... let me get this straight. I'm not crazy. I'm not alone. It's a perfectly valid way to be. It even gets a lovely little name and a creatively titled group. I don't have to feel quite so confused, or give in to pressure for something I don't want.
Wow.
-Selie
Let me also say welcome. I definitely had a similar moment when I first found other asexual people. I remember I always felt weird (and somewhat scared) in middle and highschool. What does it mean when something that's "supposed to happen", something that's "an important part of growing up", just doesn't?
We're still new, a few websites and this group, but we're growing fast. Peopel are just beginning to think about asexuality as an orientation (instead of a quirk or a problem).
I'll avoid going into too much theory at the moment (but trust me, there's tons.) Suffice it to say that not wanting to have sex in no way limits you from anything emotional, social, spiritual or otherwise. I'd love to talk more, feel free to E-mail me (djay@...) if you want to talk more about asexuality stuff.
-DJ
... there are actually people in the world who will believe me when I say I find sex completely disinteresting, that I find both genders of the human species aesthetically lovely at times (I'm an artist) but finds nothing overly appealing about seeing either naked? That I love the idea of friendship and close intimacy, but that sex is unappealing? That it isn't something I'm going to outgrow, or a figment of my imagination, or just failing to meet the right person, or reaction to a particular bad experience?
Wow.
And here I was thinking that "joking" about being asexual was about as far as I could take it. My friends call me the Pope because of my total lack of interest in sex. I don't think the world revolves around it. In fact, there are long stretches of time when it doesn't cross my mind, and when it does it's only because someone else brought it up. I've been told for years that I am imagining this, that I cannot be this way, etc etc. Of course, EVERY human being must be sex-crazed, and if I claim to be otherwise, I must be in denial. Ah, Freud, how I hate what I know of you...
So ... let me get this straight. I'm not crazy. I'm not alone. It's a perfectly valid way to be. It even gets a lovely little name and a creatively titled group. I don't have to feel quite so confused, or give in to pressure for something I don't want.
Wow.
-Selie
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Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] It's weird.
Yes. So all of a sudden I have questions, and at the same time a number of questions have been answered. I guess you could say I'm still kind of confused about this. I mean, I'm USED to telling people how I feel and being told that I don't really know how I feel, don't understand what I'm talking about, and will find myself proven wrong, wink wink nudge nudge. Like they know me and my body better than I do. That used to make me so angry and I'd argue back, and they would all give each other these knowing nods... "She'll figure it out. When she gets older, some guy will come and sweep her off her feet. And when she gets older, she'll stop being such a prude." It's like how my mom tells me I'm going to start drinking and at least experiment with drugs, "because everyone else does."
Yeah, maybe it isn't NORMAL - I mean, we're organisms that come in two sexual variations physically, and to keep our species going we reproduce sexually, so it seems reasonable to me that any type of existance beyond that defies at least some property of nature. It's like being suicidal, though; it goes against what one might think is natural, the preservation and continuation of life, but it HAPPENS. So it isn't unnatural, it's just not the norm. This makes sense, right? It's like G/L/B ... I guess? I don't know. But for some reason those are acceptable, except maybe here in the Bible Belt (I know a number of people who have had problems because of that) ... and I'm babbling again. But people don't believe we exist. They can't deny that gay people exist, even if they think that gayness is wrong, blah blah blah - but they just cannot believe that any person in the world can just not have an interest in sex. Is it THAT hard to comprehend?
I guess it is. I can't figure out why people CAN have an interest in it. I talked about this with a friend the other night, before I asked her if she thought asexuality might actually exist and she told me to look it up. And then I found you guys.
It isn't that big a deal, though, is it? It's not like coming out and throwing a party about it or anything, right? It's ... subtle. It's a not-ness, rather than a different-ness... so now I'm confused. Thing is, I still can't tell my family. For one thing, with timing, they would say I'm reacting to a particular experience in my life. For another thing, when I've told them in the past that I don't think about sex or find it interesting, they've laughed at me. But do I tell my friends that I have a name for it and I'm not just weird any more? I don't know.
Is it a big deal?
... my head hurts. I'm sure I'm not making any sense... I've been at work for hours.
I must say, though, that it feels like a burden has been lifted off my shoulders. Before, I felt like I was inevitably going to have to do something I didn't want to. Because relationships are supposed to inevitably lead to that, and people are supposed to be in relationships. But I don't have to do anything I don't want to do, right? And it feels wonderful. I can relax in who I am, and no amount of outside pressure will be able to make me do what I don't want to do ever again, not like this. Because it's okay to be the way I am. I'm not just crazy and it's not just inside my head.
Thanks.
-Selie
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A friend of mine took an evolutionary biology class recently. She came to me and told me an interesting story. Apparently Darwin got thrown for a bit of a loop when homo and bi sexuality started appearing everywhere in nature. No one quite knew what to do with this, then they looked closer and saw that asexuality is also there. This got everyone in a tizzy, and they had to run off and restructure the theory of evolution to be about group, not individual survival (or something.) The sense it makes to me is that as in interdependent social species we can contribute to our own survival in ways other than our genes. What we need right now, as a species, isn't more kids. It's the resources, society, and all around hard work it takes to raise them well. Maybe nature's got that figures out, in some way. G/L/B is a much better metaphore than suicide, I'd say. The less you think of everything in terms of straight sexuality the less confusing it will all be, in my experience anyway.
I can definitely relate to people forming sexual expecations about me (parents, etc.) It gets old fast, (though it's still occassionally amusing.) I agree that it seems remarkably hard for sexual people to comprehend not having sex (just like it seems remarkably hard for some straight people to comprehend GLB attraction.) I mean, how much is there to comprehend? It seems like the confusing part of them is letting go of all of the things that they associate with sex. What they're subconsciously thinking is, if you don't have sex how will you date/get married/have 2.5 kids. How will you possibly be emotionally and spiritually fullfilled if not through a middle class heteronormative white- picket life?
As for it being a big deal, it's really what you make it. For me personally it's a pretty big deal, thinking about asexuality (and myself as an asexual person) has been a useful way to figure out alot of stuff in my life. Alot of stuff getting lifted off of my shoulders. For others it doesn't really matter (same as with GLBT people. For some it's huge, for some it hardly matters.) I know that I definitely "came out", though instead of throwing a party I had to throw a lecture. Again, it varies from person to person. Some are fine just being known as "not that sexual" and not having their friends make a thing out of it. My advice is to figure out what it means for you. If/when you tell your friends/family the word "asexuality" will be hopelessly vague, you'll have to spend a good while defining exactly what it means/doesn't. So figure that out. Here's a great place to do it, or with friends that you feel comfortable talking to about it. In my experience the more confident you are and the more comfortable you are with your asexuality (however you define it) the more respect people will give you when you talk about it.
And you definitely don't have to do anything you don't want to. That's the bottom line, sexual empowerment (or asexual empowerment, depending on how you look at it.)
-DJ
Yes. So all of a sudden I have questions, and at the same time a number of questions have been answered. I guess you could say I'm still kind of confused about this. I mean, I'm USED to telling people how I feel and being told that I don't really know how I feel, don't understand what I'm talking about, and will find myself proven wrong, wink wink nudge nudge. Like they know me and my body better than I do. That used to make me so angry and I'd argue back, and they would all give each other these knowing nods... "She'll figure it out. When she gets older, some guy will come and sweep her off her feet. And when she gets older, she'll stop being such a prude." It's like how my mom tells me I'm going to start drinking and at least experiment with drugs, "because everyone else does."
Yeah, maybe it isn't NORMAL - I mean, we're organisms that come in two
sexual variations physically, and to keep our species going we reproduce
sexually, so it seems reasonable to me that any type of existance beyond
that defies at least some property of nature. It's like being suicidal,
though; it goes against what one might think is natural, the preservation and continuation of life, but it HAPPENS. So it isn't unnatural, it's just not the norm. This makes sense, right? It's like G/L/B ... I guess? I don't know. But for some reason those are acceptable, except maybe here in the
Bible Belt (I know a number of people who have had problems because of that) ... and I'm babbling again. But people don't believe we exist. They can't deny that gay people exist, even if they think that gayness is wrong, blah blah blah - but they just cannot believe that any person in the world can just not have an interest in sex. Is it THAT hard to comprehend?
I guess it is. I can't figure out why people CAN have an interest in it. I talked about this with a friend the other night, before I asked her if she thought asexuality might actually exist and she told me to look it up. And then I found you guys.
It isn't that big a deal, though, is it? It's not like coming out and throwing a party about it or anything, right? It's ... subtle. It's a not-ness, rather than a different-ness... so now I'm confused. Thing is, I still can't tell my family. For one thing, with timing, they would say I'm reacting to a particular experience in my life. For another thing, when I've told them in the past that I don't think about sex or find it interesting, they've laughed at me. But do I tell my friends that I have a name for it and I'm not just weird any more? I don't know.
Is it a big deal?
... my head hurts. I'm sure I'm not making any sense... I've been at work for hours.
I must say, though, that it feels like a burden has been lifted off my
shoulders. Before, I felt like I was inevitably going to have to do something I didn't want to. Because relationships are supposed to inevitably lead to that, and people are supposed to be in relationships. But I don't have to do anything I don't want to do, right? And it feels wonderful. I can relax in who I am, and no amount of outside pressure will be able to make me do what I don't want to do ever again, not like this. Because it's okay to be the way I am. I'm not just crazy and it's not just inside my head.
Thanks.
-Selie
Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] It's weird.
I don't know why, but I'm crying.
I'll keep your suggestions in mind... I suppose I have all the time in the world to decide if/when I want to make more of a deal about this publically. For now, I'll just focus on making it a part of MYSELF, not other people.
-Selie
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Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] It's weird.
I don't know why, but I'm crying.
I'll keep your suggestions in mind... I suppose I have all the time in the world to decide if/when I want to make more of a deal about this publically. For now, I'll just focus on making it a part of MYSELF, not other people.
-Selie
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it takes a bit time to "come out" even to yourself
crying? because you found a group that you may belong to ?
this is a liberal crowd here whatever you maybe, we are here to listen to you just post your questions here, we would love to have more peopel to at least interste in this topic
I don't know why, but I'm crying.
I'll keep your suggestions in mind... I suppose I have all the time in the world to decide if/when I want to make more of a deal about this publically. For now, I'll just focus on making it a part of MYSELF, not other people.
-Selie
MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx
about animals
DJ,
the last animals related research i have heard even in an overpopulated environment there are some rabbits mate the same sex, but as soon as they realised, they stop and mate the opposite sex
and i can imagine that if asexuals exist in the lower animal kingdom they "will be mated", kinda "rape" if you like to consider that way because the overpopulatants
in the animal kingdom, love does not really exist it's all about reproduction and responisbility (for mammals and birds) i am glad human is (or is it?) more advandce than the lower level animals
Curiosity overcomes me
Does this list span all ages? I seem to recall in some article I read the other day that people of all ages responded to a poll questioning sexuality with "asexual" ... I guess I'm curious? I know people who claim that people of "abnormal" sexual preference (or nonpreference, as the oft-forgotten case may be) are mostly young people who want to be different, challenge the status quo, be cutting edge, whatever. I don't believe this theory, and I'm willing to bet it doesn't hold true for asexualism either.
Sorry if I'm too talkative and spamming the list or anything. This is all very new and exciting for me.
-Selie
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Re: [Haven for the Human Amoeba] about animals
DJ,
the last animals related research i have heard even in an overpopulated environment there are some rabbits mate the same sex, but as soon as they realised, they stop and mate the opposite sex
and i can imagine that if asexuals exist in the lower animal kingdom they "will be mated", kinda "rape" if you like to consider that way because the overpopulatants
in the animal kingdom, love does not really exist it's all about reproduction and responisbility (for mammals and birds) i am glad human is (or is it?) more advandce than the lower level animals
I don't know, like I said this is just heresay through my friend. One of many interesting topics to research...
DJ,
the last animals related research i have heard even in an overpopulated environment there are some rabbits mate the same sex, but as soon as they realised, they stop and mate the opposite sex
and i can imagine that if asexuals exist in the lower animal kingdom they "will be mated", kinda "rape" if you like to consider that way because the overpopulatants
in the animal kingdom, love does not really exist it's all about reproduction and responisbility (for mammals and birds) i am glad human is (or is it?) more advandce than the lower level animals
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