Haven for the Human Amoeba

And by the way, how on earth did you come to the conclusion that AIDS could be contained through eugenics?<

Because in eugenics, conception is done in the lab.. not through sexual contact... therefore if an HIV is detected, the cell can be terminated (a mercy killing if you ask me)<<

You obviously didn't understand my question and you have a very strange view of the meaning of eugenics. Eugenics doesn't necessitate in-vitro fertilization. This is a fairly silly early 20th century concept that tried to improve the human species by encouraging supposedly "good" human specimens to procreate. Genetics just doesn't work that way. You can only breed for "good" genes if you know what the heck they are and how they are transmitted. Consequently, you can screen for certain genetic diseases, but you can't breed for something like height or face-shape which are highly multifactorial in their transmission.

HIV is not a genetic disease and it's primary mode of transmission is not vertical (i.e. from mother to child). In fact this is one of the only types of HIV spread that can be adequately controlled via pharmacological means and prevention of breast feeding. You can't breed out a communicable disease, so I have no idea how the concept of eugenics fits into HIV prevention. Also, there are certain congenital defects that cannot be screened for (e.g. cerebral palsy). Should we institute infanticide in those cases? Have you ever read Plato's Republic? I'm sure you'll be very sympathetic toward Socrates' utopia.

Judy

Eh, what about when that little cell turns into a huge mass of cells and it wishes to have intercourse with other huge masses of cells? Even if every single birth on planet earth was done within a controlled environment (heh) the virus would still propagate itself through the numbers of channels that it has historically used to become the beast it is today. Even after the current generations have expired, as it would have stair-stepped down through the new eugenically created humans as well.

Ok, I don't want to nag you for saying you like porn. That, in itself is fine. BUT---it appears to me that your view of porn is similar to that which I feel can make pornography detrimental to our society.

People in the porn industry enter the industry for many different reasons. It is unfair to assume that they enter the industry because they're stupid or have no other marketable skills. It's thoughts like that that perpetuate stereotypes (i.e. only dumb girls like sex, these girls have no personality).

The truth is we don't know what those girls are like. The truth is that people who watch porn don't -care- what those girls are like. They're objects, nothing more.

This said, I doubt that many strong-willed, intellectual, confident girls enter the porn industry. It's women who perhaps were told all their lives that they were stupid or had no marketable job skills.

In some sick way, it's more tolerable (for me) to hear someone say that they objectify women (or people in general) than to veil it under a "well, they're stupid people anyway" umbrella.

We can't have a race of perfect people. That's insane. I have my own, personal idea of human perfection. Trust me..my idea of it is nowhere near anyone else's.

Judy mentioned Gattaca, which I agree is worth the time it takes to watch the movie. Sadly, I don't believe it was too far-fetched. What do you think would happen, Eiji, with a world full of "perfect people" and a minority of us naturally imperfect people? I, for one, am a terrible genetic sample. No one would want my genes. This doesn't mean that I'm a bad person or undeserving. I just don't want to be refused a job or be treated differently simply because I wasn't tailor-made in a lab.

I think we're all a bit more interesting when we have our little physical and personality flaws...

Genetic sidenote: It is nearly impossible to "weed out" a recessive gene, as it may take generations for the gene to show up, assuming of course we know what we're looking for and exactly how it's transcribed. Unless we literally perform DNA tests on everyone on the planet and then kill or otherwise sterilize those who carry whatever "undesirable" gene we see...hmm..isn't that a high-tech version of what Hitler had in mind?

Excuse me for saying this, but I love porn. Porn hurts no one in my mind. I buy porn, I keep the porn industry afloat. I keep thousands of women who have no vauluable job skills. Whose only means of survival is either prostitution or porn. Which is safer? Obviously porn. Outlaw sex? Most definetly not. We live in the U.S. where the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness is every man's inalienable right. Of course politicians have changed that basic message over the years, but the Bill of Rights, in my opinion, is the most valuable document on the face of this planet. Without it, we would be in 1984, or Fahrenheit 451, or Brave New World.

I'm an asexual who values freedom of speech above all else.

What is this stuff about fertilization and making perfect babies? I say we don't mess with that stuff. As much as I'd like to see a Supehuman with no defects and a longevity rivaling immortalality, I've seen too many movies and cartoons where things have gone horribly wrong. I say we don't mess too much with what we have. Why can't we use the technology we have to colonize mars or something? We already have enough people on this planet? Do we really need more babies that will live 150 years and reproduce? I think not.

a utopia of that nature is for the weak.....

MY idea of paradise would be a regimented society of castes and ruling clans...

(which is pretty much what goes on in the US anyway... I just want it to be formalized in the letter of the law)

I dont agree with the statement that "I keep thousands of women who have no vauluable job skills" - i think this is merely subjective, and that if these women did not partake in porn, i am sure they would have valuable skills that they could contribute to society. I think many of them lack self-esteem, and percieve themselves not to possess any other valuable skills! And this is reaffirmed when people continously purchase their porn, and they subsequently they believe they are doing something they are 'good at" - alternatively, i know of people who are talented in many other areas, but choose porn due to its direct financial benefits, as opposed to persuing what they could be otherwise doing.

Thats all!

a utopia of that nature is for the weak.....

MY idea of paradise would be a regimented society of castes and ruling clans...

(which is pretty much what goes on in the US anyway... I just want it to be formalized in the letter of the law)<<

A utopia of what nature? The regimented caste system of which you speak is at the center of BNW and The Republic and they're both hopelessly flawed. The U.S. does not have a caste system in place otherwise social mobility would be impossible and that is certainly not the case. And why would anyone want to formalize a caste system? Do you assume that you would be at the top of the heap? This is all very bizarre, but you are, of course, free to state your own opinions (another virtue of living in a casteless society) as warped as I believe those opinions to be.

So humans were put here for the sole purpose of working? What exactly is the purpose of work? Is work in and of itself a means to an end? If I were to spend 12 hours digging a ditch for no other reason than to dig a ditch this could certainly be considered work, but what exactly have I accomplished. In the past, work was an all consuming activity for many persons due to inefficient means of production. Now that those means have been much improved, and leisure time has been greatly increased, people no longer have to be slaves to their work unless, of course, they enjoy such activity. Personally, I don't know how you could come to the conclusion that sex distracts from work. Sex is a leisure activity (unless you're a porn actor) and is perhaps one of the least time consuming leisure activities around.

Judy

We can't have a race of perfect people. That's insane. I have my own, personal idea of human perfection. Trust me..my idea of it is nowhere near anyone else's.

Judy mentioned Gattaca, which I agree is worth the time it takes to watch the movie. Sadly, I don't believe it was too far-fetched. What do you think would happen, Eiji, with a world full of "perfect people" and a minority of us naturally imperfect people? I, for one, am a terrible genetic sample. No one would want my genes. This doesn't mean that I'm a bad person or undeserving. I just don't want to be refused a job or be treated differently simply because I wasn't tailor-made in a lab.

I think we're all a bit more interesting when we have our little physical and personality flaws...

Genetic sidenote: It is nearly impossible to "weed out" a recessive gene, as it may take generations for the gene to show up, assuming of course we know what we're looking for and exactly how it's transcribed. Unless we literally perform DNA tests on everyone on the planet and then kill or otherwise sterilize those who carry whatever "undesirable" gene we see...hmm..isn't that a high-tech version of what Hitler had in mind?

Greetings Everyone. I just wanted to ask you all a couuple of questions. What reactions have you recieved when you have in fact revealed that you are asexual to people? I tend not to disclose it to people, unless necessarily, i guess more so when they assume something more than platonic will eventuate. I have found that most people dismiss it as merely being a phase, one which will not remain or i will grow out of. However, i feel the more i think and ponder on it, i become increasingly asexual, and even further deterred by sexual / physical encounters.

Does everyone know that this will be a lifelong state? or a little uncertain?

Just curious! Look forward to your replies!

Leaving in peace...Simone.

a utopia of that nature is for the weak.....

MY idea of paradise would be a regimented society of castes and ruling clans...

(which is pretty much what goes on in the US anyway... I just want it to be formalized in the letter of the law)<<

A utopia of what nature? The regimented caste system of which you speak is at the center of BNW and The Republic and they're both hopelessly flawed. The U.S. does not have a caste system in place otherwise social mobility would be impossible and that is certainly not the case. And why would anyone want to formalize a caste system? Do you assume that you would be at the top of the heap? This is all very bizarre, but you are, of course, free to state your own opinions (another virtue of living in a casteless society) as warped as I believe those opinions to be.

So humans were put here for the sole purpose of working? What exactly is the purpose of work? Is work in and of itself a means to an end? If I were to spend 12 hours digging a ditch for no other reason than to dig a ditch this could certainly be considered work, but what exactly have I accomplished. In the past, work was an all consuming activity for many persons due to inefficient means of production. Now that those means have been much improved, and leisure time has been greatly increased, people no longer have to be slaves to their work unless, of course, they enjoy such activity. Personally, I don't know how you could come to the conclusion that sex distracts from work. Sex is a leisure activity (unless you're a porn actor) and is perhaps one of the least time consuming leisure activities around.

Judy

Asexual Marxism, goody goody.

How did we get on asexuality as it relates to distopian classism again? It seems like the question that we're really asking is what would society be like without sexuality? It seems like one good place to take this discussion would be to talk about how sexuality ties into sexism. I'd delve into this topic but I have to go TA, if anyone else is interested in this topic please discuss.

-DJ

Hi everyone!

Okay, i thought i would attempt to address this request for a defintion...which i tend not to do, as it leads to labels, which should only be used for soup, but none-the-less ;-) The way i percieve asexuality to apply to me is that it is the absence of sexual activity, but can also apply to low sexual response, or a non-existent sex drive.

I have a lack of interest or involvement in sex in sexual species. This in essence means an aversion to either heterosexual or homosexual genital sexual contact. Umm, that pretty sums it up, but what i think is more important is discussing the underlying reasons and motives to this, rather than simply what you do and do not engage in! I think that way people would be more understanding, and somewhat enlighted! I hope this has helped! I could type for much longer..but i must not procrastinate any longer..uni work to be done..hehe.

Hi, The aversion to physical sexual contact may in many respects be biological, since the same reason given to gays/lesbians/bisexuals. Once discovered a family relative who never married, felt and deep relief and sense of common bond-even though never saw the person.

starry50

Hello all,

To answer the most recent posts, I have no one in my family that is even slightly asexual but I could be the exception rather than the rule. Even if it is not genitic I am sure there is some hormonial explination, so who's gonna do the scientific study on asexuals? :-P

I sooo have to agree with drk's view on porn. I must also add that if women actually had the same oportunities for education and employment as men, women would not HAVE to do it. (Sure we are allowed in college but I could tell you a thing or two about it). Anyway, women are told that all they are are walking pussies with tits only put on this earth to please men (both directly and indirectly), so what are they supposed to do? I still stand by my statement that porn has no useful point. And on a final note, how come I never hear "why is HE doing porn, he must be stupid." Okay, porn rant over. Bye all.

--GT

I was actually just thinking about one of the points you made Starry. Does anyone else have family members/relatives who you think are also asexual? I have a sister three years younger than myself who at least appears to be asexual. She is very similar to me in that she has had plenty of male friends yet never showed any interest in them other than as friends. She also has her normal group of close female friends. Unlike me she has had plenty of guys interested in her but she has always made it clear to them that she is not interested and she can be pretty intimidating when she wants to be. They get the message fast. I can't really say for sure what her situation is since I have never talked to her about it (that would be a very odd conversation to have I think) but her actions at least make her appear to be asexual whatever her inner thoughts may be. Anyone else have a similar case? Just wondering about the whole biological connection possibility.

Hello all,

To answer the most recent posts, I have no one in my family that is even slightly asexual but I could be the exception rather than the rule. Even if it is not genitic I am sure there is some hormonial explination, so who's gonna do the scientific study on asexuals? :-P

I sooo have to agree with drk's view on porn. I must also add that if women actually had the same oportunities for education and employment as men, women would not HAVE to do it. (Sure we are allowed in college but I could tell you a thing or two about it). Anyway, women are told that all they are are walking pussies with tits only put on this earth to please men (both directly and indirectly), so what are they supposed to do? I still stand by my statement that porn has no useful point. And on a final note, how come I never hear "why is HE doing porn, he must be stupid." Okay, porn rant over. Bye all.

--GT

Yes porn objectivies women, that's the entire point of porn!! Porn was put on this earth so that men could satisfy their sexual urges without cheating on their wives or going on a sexual rampage. What is worse? A man who acts out his sexual urges and forces women to have sex (rape, or consetual), or a man who goes and buys porn and takes care of business that way. To me, masterbating, is just like taking a pee. Everyone takes a pee, so why shouldn't everyone release their semen? Some people choose to have sex, I choose masterbating. In my opinion, that makes me asexual. I agree with eiji, sex is a drug. But in my opinion, if you are responsible with it, then it shouldn't be a problem. The problem isn't in outlawing sex, its Eiji's whole outlook on life. A few people abuse marijuana, but should be outlawed. A few people abuse sex, should it be outlawed? I think not. Should alcohol, cigarettes, red meat, eggs, soda, video games, the internet, inline skates be outlawed? They're all abused by a tiny majority of the population. Eiji would say outlaw them all. I would say the opposite.

Just because something is "wrong" or "evil" or "dangerous" doesn't mean it should be outlawed. Most of the people here are consenting adults who know how to make a responsible choice for themselves. WE don't need some government telling us what's right, and what's wrong with the things we do in our privacy.

That's my main point.

When talking to heteros about this topic, they can not imagine this state on the human life stream. They demean the Platonic person with the statement as previously described as "it's just a phase" . Sex should be discussed purely on the physical plane, since Platonic people can love, hug, be happy without the "act". Heteros also have the "lust factor" -a biological drive for physical fornication. This lust factor drives some people to bad relationships- no consideration to each other as human beings. Porn completely lowers humans to beastial level which encourages behaviors and thinking processes that are degrading and foul. Have dignity platonic friends and do not sink to depravity.

starry50

When talking to heteros about this topic, they can not imagine this state on the human life stream. They demean the Platonic person with the statement as previously described as "it's just a phase" . Sex should be discussed purely on the physical plane, since Platonic people can love, hug, be happy without the "act". Heteros also have the "lust factor" -a biological drive for physical fornication. This lust factor drives some people to bad relationships- no consideration to each other as human beings. Porn completely lowers humans to beastial level which encourages behaviors and thinking processes that are degrading and foul. Have dignity platonic friends and do not sink to depravity.

starry50

WE don't need some government telling us what's right, and what's wrong with the things we do in our privacy.<<

Tell that to the State of Georgia... sex toys are illegal there.. so's oral sex (if you can belive that)..

And it's the government that compromised my freedoms to be male by passing some poorly thought out "sexual harrasment" laws that leave me constantly looking over my shoulder (the policy at my college was so loose I could be expelled for just glancing at a girl to avoid crashing into her).

My outlook on life??? Well, I have nothing against skating... what's a few scrapes? Even the best safty measures don't stop those... but with sex the results can be catastrophic (unwanted pregnancy, abortion, AIDS, Syphilis, etc.)

Lively group here!!!! The news media have discovered the Seniors are going to it out in the open in Arizona. Now the Seniors will get transmitted diseases. Digging around a port town in England, scientists found syphillis ridden bones , Uck! ,in a medieval monastry- mostly paid for burial people. I think another relative never married.

sheesh.....

are ALL humans this devolved???