Haven for the Human Amoeba

Well, I stumbled on your club via a member who is also joined to the celibate support group. In many ways this group is more appropriate to my needs or lack there of.

I am a 23 year old male, and I am simply repulsed by all romantic/sexual relations. I feel as if they are not suited to me or my independence. I do not share the values of Sexualists and do not worship some Cupid God.

I had sex once when I was 21, and I doubt that I will ever have sex more than 10 times in my entire life. It simply isn't worth all of the BS and deceit. I would rather enhance my own individuality.

Are there many other males who share my "radical" views who are also members of this club?

Hi and welcome! I can't speak for the male members but I sure see where you are coming from. We actually have a good deal of male members, but they don't seem to post too much :) so you just have to be patient I guess.

e, I see where you are coming from about the militant feminist lies. Thankfully I haven't run into many like that.

Just a little note about the ring if anyone cares, OFA joined the ring and the AVEN site will be joining once they update their site...yay. I still have several unaswered mails sent out so we could be starting out pretty well. Guess that's it for now.

--GirlTech

I posted some emails to your personall addys...

if you'd like to talk more with me, just email me back...

(my addy should be in my profile... it's Eiji001@...)

Welcome, alvoalvo. I know how you feel. I've never had sex and unless I undergo some sort of bizzare brainwashing by a mad scientist I probably never will.

All in all I'm happy the way I am. I do get lonely, but lonliness seems to be a whole lot better than any of the alternatives.

As far as I am concerned loneliness is worth constant peace of mind and true freedom. I did have sex once, and though it was enjoyable in a physical sense, it was not worth the deceit and manipulation, and loss of friendship that resulted from it.

Surprisingly, there are those who don't care about the ramifications of entering into a sexual scenario, as long as they get their orgasm!!! Fortunately for me, I am above such primitive instincts, and pursue more intellectual matters with my time.

Sometimes there are hours that could be filled by someone else, but there is a distinct possibility that that would make me even lonelier!

Well let me just say that the loneliest time of my life was the only time I was in a 'relationship'. No feeling is worse than having someone and still being lonely. I wanted to get to know the person better but he was too interested in making out (which sometimes actually got physically painfull as well). I find as time goes on asexual relationships are far more fulfilling and a lot less stressful but it is hard to find other asexuals to talk to. Even having a relationship (friendship) with a sexual person is difficult because that person is still on the sexual level. I am actually less lonely by myself because atleast I actually *relate* to me! Though, I do long for a soul mate (I believe soul mates are friends too, not just 'lovers') and some one to talk to and I mean really talk to, I don't believe in having people hang around that are just losers and abusers. I don't mind being alone much (guess it comes from the abusive 'friends' that I have always found to be the only alternative to loneliness) but I hope that I can find someone that I 'connect' with eventually. Hehe now that I have ranted and raved and told my life story, I shall go away for today :-)

--GirlTech

PS getting that off my chest felt GRRREAT!!!

I can echo this, sort of. Relationships have enough kooky internal mechanichs as is, I seem to remember it was like trying to fly an airpane with only a conceptual understanding of gravity.

(Look at my beam with pride for the subtleties worked into THAT metaphore...) Sexual relationships just tend to be so caught up in EXPECTATIONS, physical as well as emotional, that it seems to be difficult to actually get to KNOW people (the bloody point, right?) I think one of the things that made a sexual relationship (or in my case a semi-sexual one) so lonely and frustrating was the idea that I wasn't supposed to be. Here I was terrified by the person who I was supposed to be most comfortable with. Though all in al it was a great learning experience I'm not out fretting to go over it again.

-David Jay

AVEN Webmaster

<a href=http://djay.web.wesleyan.edu target=new>http://djay.web.wesleyan.edu</a>

Hello all !! I can't tell you how great it is to finally find an actual breathing asexual community out there, everything I've come across so far has been dried up or nonexistant, and I'd grown lazy and distracted from my internet searchings over the summer, much to my displeasure. I hope to be an active contributer to this forum in the coming future. Props to tngirltech for notifying me.

For those of you who haven't seen it yet, I want to throw my site:

<a href=http://djay.web.wesleyan.edu target=new>http://djay.web.wesleyan.edu</a>

out there for commenting/critiquing, etc. It's past-due for a heavy round of updating as soon as I get back to school, not to mention being added to the asexual web ring.

Also curious what people think of the double-triangle AVEN symbol, which I've taken quite a liking to but others may not. The (sizable) part of me raised (for a year at least) in (or near) the flaming bowels of the Wesleyan queer community likes its etch/sketch-in-every-nook-and-crany-of-the-immediate-environment-ability, but that's just me.

That being said, a general issue to raise:

Tntechgirl sent me several existing sites, severa of which made a fairly strict point of stating that asexual people DID NOT, under any circumstances, convert, recruit, or otherwise twist the minds of innocent young chidren to devious antivirginal (ironically) ways. This strikes me because:

Who is so worried about us recruiting? I mean, I appreciate the reassurance to the poor souls out there who are under the illusion that the gays are out 'ta get 'em, but is this really a concern in what small slice of the sexual community actually knows of our existance? If we were considered anything more than a sorry lot of Fruedian outtcasts who deserve only the slightest pitying inquisition I'd be thrilled, and if they honestly think we're about to storm the gates and reclaim the planet for the bacterea then more power to 'em. May the best orientation win.

(Apologies for the overprose, it only hits me incertain moods, if it's too annoying please chide me for it.)

It also strikes me because:

I converty, recruit, etc. all the time. I do so actively, openly, flamboyantly and gladly. Sadly not everyone fits the bill, I've found that people unsure if they are lesbian or bi make especially good pickings. As I see it sexuality is frustrating and confusing for more people than me, and while it has its legitimate place in the world I think that it's encompassed far more than its fair share of territory when it comes to things like intimacy and power. So I'll spread my various theories about relationships and argue tooth and nail to anyone that you can get by fine without sexuality, indeed that all you loose is some particularely combustable dramatics and a few gallons of not-that-essential endorphines. And I've noticed (though it could well be a statistical fluke) that my close friends as a whole tend to be less likely to NEED to form a romantic relationship, and when they do the relationship they form will often resemble a platonic friendship much more than the average sample. Then there are those who will make the occassional mistake of saying something along the lines of "I haven't been dating recently and I'm really happy with it" in my approximate earshot. To these I devote special attention, and, I'll admit, a bit of hope. As I see it what the queer community did to ideas of heterosexual gender identity it's my job, as an asexual person, to do to sexual-centered ideas of intimacy. Does this make any sense? I think I've written enough of a volume here, so I'll leave it for response.

-David Jay

"...and it was said that those with Amethyst goblets could drink into the morning and keep their eye ever keen and watchful.."

Hi and Weclome! Glad you decided to join. Our club has actually nearly doubled since I joined merely a month a go and boy, is it awesome!

I would like to address the 'recruiting' statements, for my web page atleast. I can't speak for others but that statement on my page is basically to save whining and defensiveness. I just wanted to save on e-mails whining that I wanted to convert the world into a 'bunch of asexual robots' or something of the sort. Goddess knows I hear enough whining! A second reason is that I think people lower their defences when they hear that. Wether they be those unsure of their sexuality or sexual people just doing research, when they hear that they can relax and know that the purpose isn't to convert so they are more likely to listen (I mean when I used to be dragged to church nothing would shut me down to the sermon faster than 'you're going to hell if you don't do this or that'). It kind of reminds me of the same thing on a lesser level.

This is not to say that if I heard some one debating their sexuality or lack there of that I wouldn't go right up to them and have a nice talk. I really couldn't say because in my 21 years of life I have *NEVER* heard anyone say anything remotely like that. I live in a tiny town in Tennesse so there is no openly gay community or I would probably be hanging out with them. Here if you are out you could get killed.

Finally another reason for that statement is that I am not sure a person truly can be converted. Sure you can convince a sexual person that life without sex is less stressfull, but wouldn't that person be sexual still? Now I am new to this whole asexual term, but from what I have seen being asexual is not desiring sex. (To that end I don't think you can be converted gay and vise versa!) Sexuality isn't like a religion, it is who you are. You are either gay or straight, sexual or asexual. Now I am young and have very little knowledge of sex/sexuality (heck I didn't even realize that there was a sexuality for me until a month ago) so I may change my mind with more observations but from what I have seen so far, that is were I stand.

--GirlTech

All I have to say is "Amen, brother ben" to our newest member! Not only is it horrible to be lonely while in a relationship, you feel even worse because you aren't 'supposed' to feel lonely. Frankly the loneliest people I know are some of the most sexually active. I think many people today confuse sex with intimacy (NEWSFLASH, they aren't the same thing!!) then wonder why they feel so empty when they are involved sexually. I would say that commie is reading my mind on the topic but I wouldn't want to insult him...hehe!

Now, I am trying to come up with some asexual humor (nothing breaks the ice faster than humor).

I am about to post what I have so far but be forewarned: I am horrible at this kind of stuff, sarcastic humor is more my thing. So here goes:

A Simi-humorous look at Asexualism

As Asexuals we NEVER have to:

1. Fake an orgasm or a headache.

2. Suffer the humiliation of having to purchase books on how to catch/please a woman/man.

3. Learn the art of fellatio or cunnilingus.

4. Sit through the awkward moment on a date when a sex scene happens in a move (and it will happen).

5. Lie just to get sex.

6. Worry that if we do this or that we wont get laid.

As Asexuals we CAN:

1. Focus on people as people instead of sex objects.

2. Relax and have fun instead of worrying about how to make the next move.

3. Play pool or chess instead of stupid sexual games.

4. Make intellectual conversation instead of talking about sex and/or our sexual conquests 24/7.

5. Kick your ass on Temptation Island (hehe thx monty!)

6. Basically do what ever we want (if people only knew what slaves they are to sex and what it seems to make them do!).

If you can think of something to add please let me know, you will get credit.

MONTY: If you want me to remove #5 I will. Also I was wondering how you wanted credit on your other work on my pages. Do you want me to use your e-mail or profile? Let me know and it will be done :-) BTW, I haven't fallen off the planet and should be on later in the afternoon/evening, hope to see you then!

Webring Update: Well so far all the e-mails I have sent have come back with a yes on joining the ring. I am going to look for more sites to try to add today. Don't forget if you want to see a site added, e-mail me!

Finally, DRKSPARKLE I hope you are having fun! Thanks to 'mouth of the south' and her 'lacky' monty, you have a lot of catching up to do heheh ;-)

Now off I go to see the AF recruiter.

--GirlTech

PS for the record, my so called relationship was 'semisexual' as well. I am proudly still the big "V" :-D

I was in a chatroom with a few members of this club, and the question came up: Can you have a "romantic" relationship and still be celibate and/or asexual?

Personally I am more opposed to the idea of endlessly searching for romantic coddling rather than sex. (Not having sex is simply the end result.)

Also, I am curious how everyone feels about the word "celibate". I like it, and I think that it describes my mindset very well. I define it as someone who decides not to pursue another person for the purpose of kissing them and/or having sex with them.

By the way, I live in the Bay Area and kissing is just a hop, skip, and jump away from hitting the sheets. Or at least that is what I have observed.

<Can you have a "romantic" relationship and still be celibate and/or asexual?>

I hope so.

<Personally I am more opposed to the idea of endlessly searching for romantic coddling rather than sex. (Not having sex is simply the end result.)>

I guess I'm ignorant because I don't quite understand this statement. Are you saying that without all the "searching for romantic coddling," as you put it, you'd be more likely to have sex?

<Also, I am curious how everyone feels about the word "celibate". I like it, and I think that it describes my mindset very well.>

I am celibate, but the word doesn't describe my sexuality to its fullest extent.

<By the way, I live in the Bay Area and kissing is just a hop, skip, and jump away from hitting the sheets. Or at least that is what I have observed.>

Kissing can be nonsexual, believe it or not.

In my opinion you can be romantic and asexual. Romance has nothing to do with sex though I suppose sex is romantic to some people (and I KNOW sex is romanticised). To me it is more romantic to get to know people instead of seeing them as a conquest anyway.

As for your second statement, I am confused by what you mean by 'romantic coddling'. To be honest it sounds like you are saying that you would have sex if it wasn't for the emotional intanglements that could be involved. Not that I am critisizing you for it, I just want to understand what you mean.

As for celibacy, I have the same feeling as monty.

Wow the Bay area must be an interesting place! Sounds like people move fast there.

--GirlTech

Hello all my partners in crime! I hope everyone is doing okay or still breathing at least. I got one for ya:

If there was going to be a book written about asexuals/asexualism, what would you like to see discussed in the book?

Now I know the Boston Marriages book is out and I think that the folkes over at leatherspinsters have done an e-book. I have yet to read either one though I have ordered the Boston Marriages book. But really honestly think about it. A book strictly for asexuals by asexuals...what do you want to see in it?

On a different note, I was wondering what you all thought about 'love' or if ya'll believe in it. Right now I claim that I don't believe in it even though I think i do, but it is not love in the sense that other people believe in love (see, isn't it much simpler to say I don't believe in love!). I beleive that people have starting confusing love with lust and I want no part of that. Well I think that is my thought of the day (I am relegated to one you see, which is subsequently more than some people I might add).

--GirlTech

... I have some articles on my asexual page that I was wanting some feed back on. The URL is

<a href=http://www.geocities.com/tngirltech/asexual.htm target=new>http://www.geocities.com/tngirltech/asexual.htm</a>

I'd really like to hear experiences on topic of my "Defining myself as an Asexual" piece and especially how you all realte to others. And for people tired of being told they aren't normal, check out "Normalcy Defined". Okay that really is all.

--GirlTech

Good job, GirlTech. As for my own experiences, they've been rather benign. The only time in my life when I had friends who were my own age was when I was around ten, so the subject of sex wasn't a big deal. Nowadays my friends are younger than me, and on the Internet, older. No real clashes in lifestyle, to be honest. Most of my peeves lie in the oversexed society in general.

Okay, that was pretty pointless. LOL

Evidently one of my statements was unclear so let me rephrase: I am opposed to pursuing romantic coddling AND sex; I just happen to be opposed to romantic coddling a tiny bit more.

How so many people define the word "romance" is fascinating! The dictionary says it is a love affair, but hearing how it is used in this club and in the Celibacy Support Group, it would sound as if the word were meant to describe the perfect friendship!

I do seek friends with integrity, but I don't wish for my friends to touch me or kiss me persay. And I would not describe my best friendships as "romantic". And I don't feel as if I would ever want to.

How about Jeff Foxworthy's "You Might Me Asexual If..."

Seriously speaking, I'm not sure. Maybe some sort of short-story book with various writer's submissions?

On your next topic, I believe in love. I believe there are many expressions of love. A common way people express love is through sex, but, as I'm sure is obvious to those here, love is not sex and vice versa. It's an expression of it. I happen to not express love this way. I express love through friendship, cuddling, talking, writing, letting someone have the last potato chip, sharing, and many other ways.

Damm I love that song.. Anyways, love is a very difficult subject. It's a human emotion, and in my knowledge it's the hardest to understand. Anger is easy to feel, compassion is easy to feel, lonely is easy to feel, sad is easy to feel, joy is easy to feel, but how exactly do you 'feel' love??? To be honest I really have no idea, so I won't even speculate on what love is. I just know, that most people's perceptions of love are wrong. More later.

kk

Actually I wouldn't say that any of my friendships have involved romance and I doubt any will. I know I am looking for more of trust and kindness in a friend than romance. I just want some one who I can turn my back on when there are knives around if you know what I mean. Do you think that touching and kissing have to be in a relationship for it to be considered romantic? I just read your last statement that question came acroos my mind...:-)

--GT

Hehe I never thought of the expressions of love like you mentioned monty. I think that is one of my big hang ups about love. I think I have my other big prob I have with love is that the people who have claimed to be madly in love with me have done the most hurtful, hateful things. Yet another hang up is that the word is used for everything. We 'love' choclate or we 'love' our cars. The word has been diluted to nothing these days. I really don't think I can claim to believe in it because my views on it are so unconventional.

--GT

I got this e-mail from a friend and I am sure many of you can relate to this or atleast have a chuckle at it...

#1 > > Man: Where have you been all my life ?

> > > Woman: Hiding from you.

#2 > > Man: Haven't I seen you someplace before?

> > > > Woman: Yes, that's why I don't go there anymore.

#3 >

Man: Is this seat empty?

> > > > Woman: Yes, and this one will be if you sit down.

#4 > > Man: Your place or mine?

> >

Woman: Both. You go to yours, and I'll go to mine.

#5 > > Man: So, what do you do for a living?

> > > > Woman: I'm a female impersonator.

#6 > > Man: Hey baby, what's your sign?

> > > > Woman: Do not enter.

#7 > Man: How do you like your eggs in the morning?

> > > Woman: Unfertilized.

#8 Man: Your body is like a temple.

> > Woman: Sorry, there are no services today.

#9 > > Man: I would go to the end of the world for you.

> > > > Woman: But would you stay there?

#10 > > Man: If I could see you naked, I'd die happy.

> > > > Woman: If I saw you naked, I'd probably die laughing.

> > > >

SEND THIS TO ALL THE WOMEN (and men) YOU KNOW WHO NEED A GOOD LAUGH!!

*********************************************

This is not to pick on you poor guys! I just thought it was cute and it sorta pertains to the club.

--GT

I understand that you meant well... but for me this is the dating scene, described too perfectly.

The reason I became asexual/antisexual is because I got so fed up with the sterotype of "all men just want sex"... You have any idea how frustrating it is to make friends, when all you do is say "hi" and they think you're just trying to bed them? (Which I'm not, up to that point I had this "law" I followed with the few abortive dates I ever had.... I didn't even think of sex, and I wouldn't unless the girl said I could... *harumph*... Much good it's done me)

Because men are just interested in sex,and that is all.The stupid 3rd policy men have,the double standards,etc.....why would a girl want to be bothered? what else are we gonna think? we have to be very careful.......hey not trying to tart an argument i am just saying how i feel....i don`t date,i find men worthless to me since i am not in2 letting guys use me like a sex toy or get married and ruin my life,but oh well ...........

Sporadic access to E-mail sucks. Let me tell you that much. I composed something earlier which apparently didn't get through, but I'll respond to the goings-on while I've been Absent With Out LAN.

For those of you who haven't already figured out, I have a VAST index of "relationship theory" that my asexuality has, for whatever reason, inspired me to create, and I'll be using it to give my spin on just about every question asked on this forum. But before I really dive in..

Two things. The reason that the contraversy over the word celibate came up is because I (guilty 3rd party of the chat room) expressed a problem with it. Namely that celibacy implies a choice, whereas asexuality implies a state. If I tell someone that I'm celibate they'll ask why, if I tell someone I'm asexual they'll ask how, and I for me the second question is more appropriate (if alot less answerable.)

Also, looking at your site, tngirltech, was fascinating, ESPECIALLY the part about straight men, straight women, queer men and queer women. Namely because I've found pretty much exactly the same thing, queer people of the opposite gender I am instantly more at ease around, with comfort levels descending in much the same manner as you outline (along opposite gender lines.) I'm curious if other people have found this to be true as well.

And one last thing (I know this is already getting long)..

Guys are interested in more than sex, however we are sociallized from an early age to believe that we can get intimacy, safety and affection by getting sex and that saying we want intimacy, safety and affection in any way other than "I want sex" is immasculine and wrong. I think that should appreciate our lack of understanding of sexuality when dealing with this. We've been talking alot about what sexual people need to learn about us, is there anything that we need to learn about sexual people in order for them to make sense to us? It definitely seems so to me.

Ok, I'm going to make my other argument in another post..

MNP (MIR, 'cuz I can't do cyrrilic right),

BRC